I am a big comedy fan--I'll watch a comedy over a drama anyday. By Talkie era, are we talking about just the 1930-1970's time fram? or 1930-the present?
If it's pre 70's, Id say my favorites are "Some Like It Hot," (and I agree--Joe E Brown and Jack Lemmon carry the laughter) "Adam's Rib" "Miracle of Morgan's Creek" and probably "Arsenic and Old Lace" even if Cary Grant was a bit over the top at times. Or maybe "Young Frankenstein" Or "The Thin Man."
If it's to the present, I'd have to add "GhostBusters" and "Raising Arizona" to my list. And "Grosse Pointe Blank" and "The Addams Family." Oops, that's 10. Oh well. I could list a lot more than that.
Three Greatest American Talkie comedies
There are three films that have me in stitches every time I see them: Blazing Saddles, Monty Python's Life of Brian and Dr Strangelove. However I guess only one of them really counts as American. Maybe two?
When I think about the cleverest, I tend to think of things like Kind Hearts and Coronets, Mr Hulot's Holiday and The Mouse That Roared. Again, none are American. I tend to prefer the subtlety of English or French comedy, especially from the classic era.
I've been watching a lot of classic American comedies over the last few years to catch up and I've really enjoyed a lot of them, including many of the standards but I tend to prefer most of Hollywood's comedy actors in straight roles.
So if Dr Strangelove doesn't count, how about Blazing Saddles (1974), Holiday (1938) and This is Spinal Tap (1984)?
When I think about the cleverest, I tend to think of things like Kind Hearts and Coronets, Mr Hulot's Holiday and The Mouse That Roared. Again, none are American. I tend to prefer the subtlety of English or French comedy, especially from the classic era.
I've been watching a lot of classic American comedies over the last few years to catch up and I've really enjoyed a lot of them, including many of the standards but I tend to prefer most of Hollywood's comedy actors in straight roles.
So if Dr Strangelove doesn't count, how about Blazing Saddles (1974), Holiday (1938) and This is Spinal Tap (1984)?
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jdb1
And we're so glad you're here, Dawtrina. You give us a point of view that comes from a different place (in this case, literally).
We were raised on, primarily, American comedy, and so I think most of us, up until recently, saw European cinema generally as "art," rather than as just a night at the movies. This is how European films were presented to us -- you had to go to a special movie theater to see them, and they were in a foreign language, which meant you had to use a bit more brain power to understand and appreciate them, etc.
I didn't care much for British movies until the "kitchen sink" dramas and working class comedies were circulated here. It showed us a facet of British life most of us were completely unfamiliar with (having heretofore seen only "drawing-room" fare and spy movies). In the late 50s/early 60s, I started to really like British comedies, and when Hard Day's Night was released, most of America became fans of the genre, whether they realized it or not.
French comedy is another story. Most of the time, I find myself sort of laughing politely, but not really engaged by what I see. I've never really caught the M. Hulot bug, although I like portions of the movies very much. When I was in high school, we were taken to see many French comedies as part of the French language curriculum. It was an eye-opener for sure, as most of them had distinctly anti-American aspects.
But M. Hulot - I think he was just a bit too rarefied and "precious" for my taste. Are you familiar with the Hulot take-off done by the Canadian comedy troupe Kids in the Hall? They are short, pantomime pieces of deliberately not much charm, called "Mr. Heavyfoot/M. Piedlourd" (bilingual because it's Canadian). Those make me laugh more than Hulot ever did.
We were raised on, primarily, American comedy, and so I think most of us, up until recently, saw European cinema generally as "art," rather than as just a night at the movies. This is how European films were presented to us -- you had to go to a special movie theater to see them, and they were in a foreign language, which meant you had to use a bit more brain power to understand and appreciate them, etc.
I didn't care much for British movies until the "kitchen sink" dramas and working class comedies were circulated here. It showed us a facet of British life most of us were completely unfamiliar with (having heretofore seen only "drawing-room" fare and spy movies). In the late 50s/early 60s, I started to really like British comedies, and when Hard Day's Night was released, most of America became fans of the genre, whether they realized it or not.
French comedy is another story. Most of the time, I find myself sort of laughing politely, but not really engaged by what I see. I've never really caught the M. Hulot bug, although I like portions of the movies very much. When I was in high school, we were taken to see many French comedies as part of the French language curriculum. It was an eye-opener for sure, as most of them had distinctly anti-American aspects.
But M. Hulot - I think he was just a bit too rarefied and "precious" for my taste. Are you familiar with the Hulot take-off done by the Canadian comedy troupe Kids in the Hall? They are short, pantomime pieces of deliberately not much charm, called "Mr. Heavyfoot/M. Piedlourd" (bilingual because it's Canadian). Those make me laugh more than Hulot ever did.
Last edited by jdb1 on December 27th, 2007, 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I too have been immune to the charms of Jacques Tati. I think I got my innoculation at the hands of snobby people who kept insisting that Tati was the only funny person in movies since talkies began.
(Personally, I imagine that the French don't like Tati either, but simply say to each other: "I hear they love him in America.")
Of non-English language comedies, I like Italian comedies the best. Alberto Sordi is terrific. "Everybody Go Home," "Mafioso," "Traffic Jam" are films that show him off to great effect. "Big Deal on Madonna Street" is also a comic gem.
(Personally, I imagine that the French don't like Tati either, but simply say to each other: "I hear they love him in America.")
Of non-English language comedies, I like Italian comedies the best. Alberto Sordi is terrific. "Everybody Go Home," "Mafioso," "Traffic Jam" are films that show him off to great effect. "Big Deal on Madonna Street" is also a comic gem.
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Mr. Arkadin
- Posts: 2645
- Joined: April 14th, 2007, 3:00 pm
I like Tati very much. The man was a genius with sight gags and Mon Oncle (1958) is one of my absolute favorite films of all time.
Sometimes I think American audiences expect him to be more like Chaplin, Keaton, Lloyd, or other silent masters and feel let down by the lack of action in his character. Although Tati was no slouch at physical comedy, Hulot's nature has always been introspective. In a world of changing technology, morals, and loyalty, he is a plumb line of the human heart, showing us the individualism, honor, and kindness of man. Hulot's ability to thrive in such desolate surroundings comforts us that all is not lost and perhaps simple goodness can indeed brighten up a drab existence--or send it into chaos.
Sometimes I think American audiences expect him to be more like Chaplin, Keaton, Lloyd, or other silent masters and feel let down by the lack of action in his character. Although Tati was no slouch at physical comedy, Hulot's nature has always been introspective. In a world of changing technology, morals, and loyalty, he is a plumb line of the human heart, showing us the individualism, honor, and kindness of man. Hulot's ability to thrive in such desolate surroundings comforts us that all is not lost and perhaps simple goodness can indeed brighten up a drab existence--or send it into chaos.
Last edited by Mr. Arkadin on December 27th, 2007, 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Moraldo Rubini
- Posts: 1094
- Joined: April 19th, 2007, 11:37 am
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Add me to the Pro-Tati list! I've enjoyed many of his films, but Playtime is my favorite. It's his masterpiece.
I could never narrow down to three comedies though. I used the think that Woody Allen's Sleeper was the funniest movie I'd seen; but I haven't seen it since it was released. Generally, I think of The Awful Truth as my favorite comedy. It was recently shown on TCM and I was reminded how much I truly love this movie and the repartee of Grant and Dunne.
I discovered and fell in love with Midnight earlier this year at Palo Alto's Stanford Theatre. Fantastic. I don't understand why we don't hear about it more.
I believe that neither The Major and the Minor nor Nothing Sacred have been mentioned -- two more favorites of mine. The wit of It Happened One Night still suprises me, The Importance of Being Ernest is a treasure.
For newer movies, Young Frankenstein, Pee Wee's Great Adventure, even Borat caught my fancy. In theatres now is Juno, the star of which is the dialogue. It's dialogue that doesn't quite fit the characters (it didn't seem believable that a 16 year old -- even a precocious one -- would say these lines; rather they're something from a 19 or 20-year-old, a young college student perhaps), but it's smartly written nevertheless.
I could never narrow down to three comedies though. I used the think that Woody Allen's Sleeper was the funniest movie I'd seen; but I haven't seen it since it was released. Generally, I think of The Awful Truth as my favorite comedy. It was recently shown on TCM and I was reminded how much I truly love this movie and the repartee of Grant and Dunne.
I discovered and fell in love with Midnight earlier this year at Palo Alto's Stanford Theatre. Fantastic. I don't understand why we don't hear about it more.
I believe that neither The Major and the Minor nor Nothing Sacred have been mentioned -- two more favorites of mine. The wit of It Happened One Night still suprises me, The Importance of Being Ernest is a treasure.
For newer movies, Young Frankenstein, Pee Wee's Great Adventure, even Borat caught my fancy. In theatres now is Juno, the star of which is the dialogue. It's dialogue that doesn't quite fit the characters (it didn't seem believable that a 16 year old -- even a precocious one -- would say these lines; rather they're something from a 19 or 20-year-old, a young college student perhaps), but it's smartly written nevertheless.
Wow, I wasn't expecting a Hulot war! I should add that I'm new to Jacques Tati. I've seen precisely one, which may well not be his best, but I loved it. To my English eyes, he's just like Mr Bean except forty years earlier. I was also amazed not just by what he did as an actor in Mr Hulot's Holiday but what he did with the rest of the film: the use of sound is innovative and delightful.
My favourite French comedy of more recent years is Amelie, which is possibly the most joyous film I've ever seen in my life. Now I've caught up with a lot of Louis Malle, courtesy of TCM, I realise that Jeunet took a lot of influence from the first half of Zazie dans le métro.
British comedy is a strange thing. At one end we have what could be described as naughty: everything from saucy seaside postcards to Benny Hill to the Carry On movies. Everyone in England grew up on some generation of this concept, and they're as dumb as they are fun. At the other end we have very literate, clever humour, which could also take many forms: from the Ealing comedies to intelligent sitcoms (not a contradiction in terms in England) to panel shows like Have I Got News for You on TV or Just a Minute on radio.
Most of these things just couldn't translate into another culture, because they're too English, whether they be the dumb end or the intelligent end. How rooted in culture something is has a lot to do with its success in another culture, and lots of English humour benefits from knowledge of previous generations of English humour. That's why Four Weddings and a Funeral did so well in England the same year that Forrest Gump did so well in the States. We didn't have a clue what Forrest Gump was about: it just felt like a big excuse to sell lots of soundtrack CDs. Similarly many Americans didn't get Four Weddings.
My favourite French comedy of more recent years is Amelie, which is possibly the most joyous film I've ever seen in my life. Now I've caught up with a lot of Louis Malle, courtesy of TCM, I realise that Jeunet took a lot of influence from the first half of Zazie dans le métro.
British comedy is a strange thing. At one end we have what could be described as naughty: everything from saucy seaside postcards to Benny Hill to the Carry On movies. Everyone in England grew up on some generation of this concept, and they're as dumb as they are fun. At the other end we have very literate, clever humour, which could also take many forms: from the Ealing comedies to intelligent sitcoms (not a contradiction in terms in England) to panel shows like Have I Got News for You on TV or Just a Minute on radio.
Most of these things just couldn't translate into another culture, because they're too English, whether they be the dumb end or the intelligent end. How rooted in culture something is has a lot to do with its success in another culture, and lots of English humour benefits from knowledge of previous generations of English humour. That's why Four Weddings and a Funeral did so well in England the same year that Forrest Gump did so well in the States. We didn't have a clue what Forrest Gump was about: it just felt like a big excuse to sell lots of soundtrack CDs. Similarly many Americans didn't get Four Weddings.
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jdb1
Yes, Dawtrina, it's a fascinating study - what people find funny and what they do not. You can turn it into an intellectual debate - I think of the Monty Python troupe's constant references to Henri Bergson - or you can simply accept that some humor is universal, and some is not.
I think Benny Hill, for example, was quite popular here, because at the time his programs were run in the States (probably the 70s) many people were intimidated by the more "literate" British humor we were seeing, and found Hill more of the people, as it were. I remember an acquaintance of mine saying at the time that Hill was a British program both he and his working-class parents could enjoy.
Interesting, for example, how popular the "Britcoms" are among the public television aficianados, but not among the general TV viewing public here. One thing that I find very different about British TV characters is that they are not afraid to be horrible, whereas American TV characters always have to be lovable in some way. So many British shows were re-packaged for American viewers in American versions and failed, because the fundamental nastiness (and intelligence) of the lead character was softened, and so the premise just didn't make much sense. Imagine an American version of the id-laden Mr. Bean. Not gonna happen. What happened to the American version of AbFab that Roseanne was trying to launch? I can't even contemplate what American TV execs would do to the self-absorbed characters and scathing humor of that one.
By the way, one such show I personally don't find enchanting is Keeping Up Appearances. That is so very English to me, allowing someone to behave so objectionably, and never saying anything for fear of "making a scene." I find it very frustrating to watch, more frustrating than funny. I always tell my English friends that Hyacinth Bucket wouldn't last 5 minutes in Brooklyn -- someone would surely kill her.
I think Benny Hill, for example, was quite popular here, because at the time his programs were run in the States (probably the 70s) many people were intimidated by the more "literate" British humor we were seeing, and found Hill more of the people, as it were. I remember an acquaintance of mine saying at the time that Hill was a British program both he and his working-class parents could enjoy.
Interesting, for example, how popular the "Britcoms" are among the public television aficianados, but not among the general TV viewing public here. One thing that I find very different about British TV characters is that they are not afraid to be horrible, whereas American TV characters always have to be lovable in some way. So many British shows were re-packaged for American viewers in American versions and failed, because the fundamental nastiness (and intelligence) of the lead character was softened, and so the premise just didn't make much sense. Imagine an American version of the id-laden Mr. Bean. Not gonna happen. What happened to the American version of AbFab that Roseanne was trying to launch? I can't even contemplate what American TV execs would do to the self-absorbed characters and scathing humor of that one.
By the way, one such show I personally don't find enchanting is Keeping Up Appearances. That is so very English to me, allowing someone to behave so objectionably, and never saying anything for fear of "making a scene." I find it very frustrating to watch, more frustrating than funny. I always tell my English friends that Hyacinth Bucket wouldn't last 5 minutes in Brooklyn -- someone would surely kill her.
Brit sitcoms.
Hi, Judith, can I get in a comment or two?
I think Benny Hill's popularity was due to the cheesecake, I can't see where his ribald humor was funny at all. You're right about the sitcoms being unfunny: the one with Patricia Routledge and the one about the department store. Jean likes 'As Time Goes By', she liked the previous one, 'A Fine Romance'. I avoid them mostly because of the laugh machine but there was one I thought very good, 'No, Honestly! with Pauline Collins and John Alderton. Most American sitcoms lost me, I liked 'Car 54' and 'All in the Family' and my favorite, Amos 'n' Andy I recall readind a review about different tastes in comedy where the author commented about Laurel and Hardy. He / she said that one day the theater audience roared with laughter over a L & H film and the next day ( same film ) there wasn't a giggle. .. mel
I think Benny Hill's popularity was due to the cheesecake, I can't see where his ribald humor was funny at all. You're right about the sitcoms being unfunny: the one with Patricia Routledge and the one about the department store. Jean likes 'As Time Goes By', she liked the previous one, 'A Fine Romance'. I avoid them mostly because of the laugh machine but there was one I thought very good, 'No, Honestly! with Pauline Collins and John Alderton. Most American sitcoms lost me, I liked 'Car 54' and 'All in the Family' and my favorite, Amos 'n' Andy I recall readind a review about different tastes in comedy where the author commented about Laurel and Hardy. He / she said that one day the theater audience roared with laughter over a L & H film and the next day ( same film ) there wasn't a giggle. .. mel
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jdb1
Re: Brit sitcoms.
Me, Mel, I like ribald once in while, and I liked the naughty, manic but always sweet TV persona of Benny Hill. Your mentioning "No, Honestly" brings up a case in point. I recall an American version - I don't remember who the man was, but I think the woman was Shelly Fabares. It was heavy-handed and unfunny, and I don't remember seeing more than one episode.melwalton wrote:Hi, Judith, can I get in a comment or two?
I think Benny Hill's popularity was due to the cheesecake, I can't see where his ribald humor was funny at all. You're right about the sitcoms being unfunny: the one with Patricia Routledge and the one about the department store. Jean likes 'As Time Goes By', she liked the previous one, 'A Fine Romance'. I avoid them mostly because of the laugh machine but there was one I thought very good, 'No, Honestly! with Pauline Collins and John Alderton. Most American sitcoms lost me, I liked 'Car 54' and 'All in the Family' and my favorite, Amos 'n' Andy I recall readind a review about different tastes in comedy where the author commented about Laurel and Hardy. He / she said that one day the theater audience roared with laughter over a L & H film and the next day ( same film ) there wasn't a giggle. .. mel
I generally like the British shows, not least because they show us something a little different from the usual generic stuff we get here. However, some don't speak to me at all, and besides Keeping Up Appearances, As Time Goes By is another that leaves me cold. I like the Python-esque stuff more, but I've enjoyed some of the more genteel comedies, such as To the Manor Born and Good Neighbo(u)rs. There are many, many Britcoms of the type where "nothing happens," but it doesn't happen so charmlingly and intelligently that it keeps my interest. Two of my all-time favorites are The Fall and Rise of Reginald Perrin (manic), and Butterflies (very gentle). We don't get much like them in the US, worse luck.
I enjoy comedies but not to the extent that I enjoy other types of films. Most comedies rely almost entirely on situations and performances, leaving cinematic technique on the back burner. Of course, there are notable exceptions to this dictum (Chaplin, Keaton, Tati, etc), but overall this seems to be the case. Films so reliant on these components are difficult to watch (for me) more than a time or two.
My all-time favorite comedy film is SONS OF THE DESERT (1934) with Laurel and Hardy. No other film makes me laugh as hard (and as often) as this one. This can also be said of most of their short films.
[youtube][/youtube]
If I had to name two other comedies, I would call up Preston Sturges' PALM BEACH STORY (1942)
[youtube][/youtube]
and Mitchell Leisen's MIDNIGHT (1939).
[youtube][/youtube]
Not only are they screamingly funny, but cinematically stylish as well.
My all-time favorite comedy film is SONS OF THE DESERT (1934) with Laurel and Hardy. No other film makes me laugh as hard (and as often) as this one. This can also be said of most of their short films.
[youtube][/youtube]
If I had to name two other comedies, I would call up Preston Sturges' PALM BEACH STORY (1942)
[youtube][/youtube]
and Mitchell Leisen's MIDNIGHT (1939).
[youtube][/youtube]
Not only are they screamingly funny, but cinematically stylish as well.
Brit comedy
Judith
I didn't know about the American version of 'No, Honestly!'. Inre what's funny, there's a British movie site ( a good one ) where many people think the "Carry On' movies were very funny. Yes, it's subjective.
I liked those comedies with Peter Sellers, Lionel Jeffries, Bernard Cribbons and David Lodge. Also the ones with David Attenborough, Ian Carmichael and Terry Thomas. Did you see 'Your Past is Showing?
I didn't know about the American version of 'No, Honestly!'. Inre what's funny, there's a British movie site ( a good one ) where many people think the "Carry On' movies were very funny. Yes, it's subjective.
I liked those comedies with Peter Sellers, Lionel Jeffries, Bernard Cribbons and David Lodge. Also the ones with David Attenborough, Ian Carmichael and Terry Thomas. Did you see 'Your Past is Showing?
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jdb1
Re: Brit comedy
Sounds familiar -- is it about a gossip sheet reporting blackmailing his subjects? Terry-Thomas? I think it was also known as "The Naked Truth." Some of those British B&W comedies of the 50s and early 60s are really hilarious.melwalton wrote:Judith
I didn't know about the American version of 'No, Honestly!'. Inre what's funny, there's a British movie site ( a good one ) where many people think the "Carry On' movies were very funny. Yes, it's subjective.
I liked those comedies with Peter Sellers, Lionel Jeffries, Bernard Cribbons and David Lodge. Also the ones with David Attenborough, Ian Carmichael and Terry Thomas. Did you see 'Your Past is Showing?
your past is showing
Judith
Yes. Dennis Price was the blackmailer; I thought some parts hilarious,
Joan Simms was wonderful.
Yes. Dennis Price was the blackmailer; I thought some parts hilarious,
Joan Simms was wonderful.
If we can use modern movies from Britain, I can name a couple that are faves of mine: "Waking Ned Devine" and "The Full Monty." Hilarious, once you get used to the accents.
Also, it's interesting how a lot of shows that started on the BBC now have American versions, like "Whose Line Is It Anyway?" and "Trading Spaces."
Also, it's interesting how a lot of shows that started on the BBC now have American versions, like "Whose Line Is It Anyway?" and "Trading Spaces."
"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars. "~~Wilde