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Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

cinemalover wrote:Thank you for the answer. My question was actually intended for your knowledge of Mix's films that no longer exist. What would be considered his best film that is not on the list of survivors. A film that is forever lost but that you may have knowledge of, even if you never had the chance to see it.
I understood your question, but to a certain extent the Mix films were formulaic, i.e. Cowboy drifter falls in love with rancher's daughter and helps save the ranch . . .

There is nothing about the plots, per se, that jumps out as a must see, and from about 1922 to the end of his Fox years the reviews are pretty consistently positive so there's nothing to make one stand out from the other on paper. What makes the films stand out are the stunts, and there are only odd descriptions of some of those in the reviews of the time.

I suppose for historical and artistic reasons one would like to see "Three Jumps Ahead" (1923) directed by John Ford.

BTW I forgot to mention that "North of Hudson Bay" (1924) directed by Ford does survive, as well, though incomplete and with Czech titles.

I'd like to see "No Man's Gold" (1926) which had the same basic plot as "The Rider of Death Valley" (1932) just to compare.
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moira finnie
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Post by moira finnie »

Thanks for the great answer about the origins of your passion for the movies. Here are a few more queries:

Cecil B DeMille's impact on the movies and the public's perception of him seems to have changed over time. Do you think that his style evolved much during the transition from silents to the sound era?

Having seen the Charles Bickford movie Dynamite (1929) recently, it seemed as though the director might have been a bit inhibited by the technical challenges of the new technology at that time. Was there a subsequent movie when you think DeMille became comfortable with sound?

When did he first narrate one of his own movies? Was it after he became a familiar voice on the radio thanks to the Lux Radio Theatre?

Was DeMille as politically conservative as he is sometimes described?

Thank you again!
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Btw, reading your wonderful comments about Tom Mix's preference for live performing has jogged my memory. Picture me, about 13 in Catholic School. One day in the 1970s, this crazy old nun who is teaching us English (at least she was crazy and old from our vantage point as smug youngsters), segues into a reminiscence of her youth while we were reading The Iliad and discussing the nature of the hero.

Once we got over the shocking idea of any nun having an out of the convent existence, she proceeds to tell us about Tom Mix and his companion, Tony the Wonder Horse coming to town and her meeting with her hero, which sparked, for just a moment, a very bright memory 50 years later as her eyes lit up describing him and his steed. Apparently Mr. Mix was very kind to his young fan that day and the ardor with which she described this story touched even our callous adolescent hearts. Of course, we all wondered who the heck Tom Mix was as well. Fortunately, the next day she brought in a movie version of Wolper's "Hollywood the Golden Years", which was great fun. Thanks for reminding me of this film and this previously forgotten incident.
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Post by MissGoddess »

BTW I forgot to mention that "North of Hudson Bay" (1924) directed by Ford does survive, as well, though incomplete and with Czech titles.

Hi Mr. B! As a huge John Ford fan, I'd like to know if you can tell me whether or not this particular movie is available anywhere for viewing?

Thank you,

MissG
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Post by mrsl »

Mr. Birchard:

Since my buddy jondaris read my mind and asked my question about Mr. Mix' voice, I'll simply ask about Tony. What happened to him? I know Mr. Mix owned a lot of land, did he just turn him out to pasture when he grew too old for the circus, or what?

Secondly, you mention Tom was very happy-go-lucky and always smiling, do you know any reason why two of his five marriages only lasted one year? I really regret the feud between him and John Wayne, both working with Mr. Ford, we could possibly have had some even greater films than we now have with the two of them as leads unless their egos were too large.

Thank you for your responses.

Anne
Anne


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Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

MissGoddess wrote:BTW I forgot to mention that "North of Hudson Bay" (1924) directed by Ford does survive, as well, though incomplete and with Czech titles.

Hi Mr. B! As a huge John Ford fan, I'd like to know if you can tell me whether or not this particular movie is available anywhere for viewing?

Thank you,

MissG
The UCLA Film and Television Archive has a 16mm print that you could arrange to see if you're in Los Angeles.
radiotelefonia
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Post by radiotelefonia »

Good evening Bob:

It is very nice to be able to have some sort of direct contact with you.

I leave you a sheet music from Argentina that I won't be able to locate, since I am in Massachusetts. However, it could be interesting to find it (it shouldn't be impossible) and to locate the original still from which the illustration was created.

William S. Hart deserved a better drawing!

Image

I'm watching tonight online (from Argentina) at 11:30 PM EST, "Filmoteca". This week, they will devote the show to Lon Chaney playing several films with live musical accompaniment in the studio (Hopefully, I will be able to get a better score for THE PENALTY, since I don't like the one in the DVD).

That show, two weeks ago, played the opening sequences of THE GREAT K & A TRAIN ROBBERY. While I don't exactly like the style of the performers at least they are performing essentially live in front of a screen.
Last edited by radiotelefonia on November 12th, 2007, 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

mrsl wrote:Mr. Birchard:

Since my buddy jondaris read my mind and asked my question about Mr. Mix' voice, I'll simply ask about Tony. What happened to him? I know Mr. Mix owned a lot of land, did he just turn him out to pasture when he grew too old for the circus, or what?

Secondly, you mention Tom was very happy-go-lucky and always smiling, do you know any reason why two of his five marriages only lasted one year? I really regret the feud between him and John Wayne, both working with Mr. Ford, we could possibly have had some even greater films than we now have with the two of them as leads unless their egos were too large.

Thank you for your responses.

Anne
Tony outlived Tom by several years. He was left to Tom's attorney, Ivon Parker, and died, if I recall correctly, sometime around 1944.

It would only be speculation on my part why Tom's marriages were failures. His first wife didn't like the military life as a result Tom was persauded to go AWOL after re-upping in the Army. She may not have cared for Oklahoma life any better. Tom is said to have visited with his second wife, Jewel Perrine, off and on over the years when he was in Oklahoma.

The only one of Tom's wives I met was Olive Stokes Mix, and she was every bit as tough and hard-edged as any cowboy I ever met. She may have been hard to put up with over the long haul.

Victoria turned into a social climber and liked to hang out with a crowd that looked down on Mix's cowboy persona and films.

There are surviving candid still pictures that suggest Tom's relationships with Dolores Rousse and Dorothy Dwan may have had more to them than just leading man/leading lady cordiality.
Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

radiotelefonia wrote:Good evening Bob:

It is very nice to be able to have some sort of direct contact with you.

I leave you a sheet music from Argentina that I won't be able to locate, since I am in Massachusetts. However, it could be interesting to find it (it shouldn't be impossible) and to locate the original still from which the illustration was created.

William S. Hart deserved a better drawing

The sheet music appears to be related to "Pinto Ben" (1915).
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Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

Dear Mr. Birchard,

I feel we are so privileged to have you with us here at SSO, and we are all grateful to Lynn for arranging your visit.

One of my favorite actresses is Lillian Gish, and I was wondering what insights you might give us about her life and her films, and if she and Mr. De Mille ever crossed paths much socially or professionally.

Miss Gish once said that "I've never been in style, so I can't go out of style," but maybe you might illuminate those moments when she was "in style." Her longevity, and her brilliant performance in Night of the Hunter decades after her first screen performance certainly reveal her dedication to her craft and her expertise , and I was hoping you might comment on her body of work.

Thank you.
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Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Dear Mr. Birchard,

I feel we are so privileged to have you with us here at SSO, and we are all grateful to Lynn for arranging your visit.

One of my favorite actresses is Lillian Gish, and I was wondering what insights you might give us about her life and her films, and if she and Mr. De Mille ever crossed paths much socially or professionally.

Miss Gish once said that "I've never been in style, so I can't go out of style," but maybe you might illuminate those moments when she was "in style." Her longevity, and her brilliant performance in Night of the Hunter decades after her first screen performance certainly reveal her dedication to her craft and her expertise , and I was hoping you might comment on her body of work.

Thank you.
Thanks for the kind words.

I'm sure that Gish and DeMille must have met along the way, but they never worked together, and there's no indication that they were close socially.

My thoughts on Lillian Gish are somewhat random. I remember seeing her in person at UCLA's Royce Hall a number of years ago when she brought her one-woman show to town. The evening consisted of her reminiscenses and film clips. Most of what she said was readily available in the many published interviews she gave and in her own book, but what I remember most of the evening was that the clip she showed from "The Wind" was accompanied only by a track of wind blowing sound effects, and it was an eerie, appropriate and highly effective way to treat the climactice scenes.

The most startling Lillian Gish screen role for me was in "Annie Laurie," which I saw at Cinecon 25 in Cleveland, Ohio, the last of Cinecon's roving years before it settled in Los Angeles. The film was screened at an Arts auditorium, and organist Bob Vaughan was seated behind the screen and could only see the film via a tiny, flickering TV monitor mounted on the organ console, but he really made the film come alive. In many ways the film is a "by-the-numbers" Gish vehicle, with moments from her famous films dusted off, slightly modified, and trotted out again because "If they loved it once, they'll love it again." But the film was absolutely magical with Bob Vaughn's score that day. And director John Robertson became a favorite of mine, and he hasn't disappointed as I've been able to see some of his other films since, including "Captain Salvation" (1927), "The Bright Shawl" (1923), "The Single Standard" (1929), "His Greatest Gamble" (1934), et. al.

I've also come to know that Miss Lillian's memories were not always 100% accurate (whose are?). She was D.W. Griffith's greatest champion in later years, but when he initially left Biograph in 1913 neither Gish nor any of the other members of the Griffith Stock company quit in protest. They all stayed on at Biograph for several months until he finally landed at Reliance-Majestic, and during this time Gish and Blanche Sweet sometimes worked with director Tony O'Sullivan at Biograph. Gish was not alone in neglecting to remember that Griffith's loyal troupe had not been loyal to the point of foolishness. I asked Blanche Sweet about working with O'Sullivan and she denied she ever worked with him. But I have O'sullivan's scrapbook, so I knew different, but I didn't call her on it.
Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

Chat groups, like newspapers, are at best a first draft of history, and I need to make a little correction from an earlier post here. Tom Mix made nine films for Universal, so it was on the third (not the fifth) film of the season on which he had the accident that led to the setting aside of his Universal contract.
Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Dear Mr. Birchard,

Miss Gish once said that "I've never been in style, so I can't go out of style," but maybe you might illuminate those moments when she was "in style." Her longevity, and her brilliant performance in Night of the Hunter decades after her first screen performance certainly reveal her dedication to her craft and her expertise , and I was hoping you might comment on her body of work.

Thank you.
I wanted to follow up on my earlier post, although this has nothing to do with Lillian Gish, but is does concern Jesse Lasky and DeMille and Blanche Sweet.


In 1915 Jesse Lasky went after (in a professional way) Blanche Sweet to sign her for the Jesse L. Lasky Feature Play Company. He was certain that she would add a lot of lustre to the stable of Lasky players.

Negotiatons were tough and he finally signed her for $750 a week. A tidy sum in 1915.

Sweet worked with DeMille in "The Warrens of Virginia" and "The Captive" and stayed at the Lasky studio for a couple of years, but she and DeMille never got along, and it would be difficult to suggest that Sweet's presence on the Lasky roster added much star power after all.

It might have been interesting if Lasky had signed Gish instead of Sweet.
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Post by movieman1957 »

I thought your description of the editing process very informative. That leads me to ask how has the process changed over the years? Of older movies how much of what we see is the editor's decision as compared to the director's leading?

Thanks.
Chris

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Bob Birchard
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Post by Bob Birchard »

movieman1957 wrote:I thought your description of the editing process very informative. That leads me to ask how has the process changed over the years? Of older movies how much of what we see is the editor's decision as compared to the director's leading?

Thanks.
The director-editor relationship is dynamic, just as any other working relationship.

What is true is that before the 1950s it was the producer (often listed as associate producer in the early days) who controlled the picture, and the director would have little input on the editing--often because he was on to shooting another picture. The exceptions were those directors who were also producers--Cecil B. DeMille, Alfred Hitchcock, Howard Hawks, Ernst Lubitsch, etc.

[I know the above might be a little confusing because of the lack of definition of what a producer is and/or does and the changes in this position through the years. Typically in the studio system there was an executive in charge of overall production, and several assoiciate producers who oversaw slates of several films a year. Associate producer had a different connotatition than it does today]

Today directors are seen more often in the cutting room. Some (like Clent Eastwood) leave the editor alone and make notes on what they see at daily screenings. Others (like Michael Mann) hover over the editor's shoulder. Some directors want creative input from their editors, others merely want "a pair of hands" to do the director's bidding.

As for who decides what, it is always an open question, and when you're collaborating it is not what you think about. The goal, I've found, is to always try to make the picture the best it can be. When you're in the trenches, no one has time to keep a slate of director's touches vs. editor's finesses; and after the film is completed it is often not possible to remember, nor is it terribly important. The picture works or it doesn't and it stands on its own, the sum of the various creative contributions along the way.
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Post by MissGoddess »

The UCLA Film and Television Archive has a 16mm print that you could arrange to see if you're in Los Angeles.

Thanks, Mr. B. The next time I'm on the West Coast I would like to make time to visit the Archive again.
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