Our September Guest Star: Karen Burroughs Hannsberry

[moirafinnie]

Here's the spot to ask our visiting author, Karen Burroughs Hannsberry, questions about her field of expertise. Ms. Hannsberry, who is the author of Bad Boys: The Actors of the Film Noir (McFarland) and Femme Noir: Bad Girls of Film (McFarland), will be here from Monday, September 21st to Friday, September 25th to discuss the men and women who darkened Film Noir in its heyday.

In case you ever wondered about the background of everyone from Lauren Bacall to Loretta Young to Luther Adler to Cornel Wilde, Monday is the day to start submitting your queries to this spot.

To get us started I'd like to thank Karen for her generosity in "appearing" here to discuss this endlessly fascinating topic in film. As someone whose interest in noir has led to the publication of two books on this topic, (with Femme Noir's release in paperback imminent), could you please offer a brief outline about what sparked your interest in this type of film and why you think it has continued resonance with so many of us? FYI: Our guest's screen name is Gypsy1962.

This discussion is now closed to new comments. Thank you, Karen, and thanks to all our members for their participation in this event.

[MissGoddess]

Hi Karen! First of all, welcome, Karen, and it's always cool when a girl is into noir, non? My favorite actor
in the style/"genre" is Robert Ryan, so anything you can share about where you place him in the
noir universe or any interesting insight you can share about his contributions would be appreciated.

I have not read your books, yet, so forgive me if this takes you back over dangerous ground previously covered.

The discussion in this forum is now ended.

[stuart.uk]

Hi Karen

I'm from the UK and I'm trying to think of UK bad boys and girls of the genre

Dirk Bogarde in The Blue Lamp and Cast A Dark Shadow. Nigel Havers did an 80s tv series called The Charmer, which appears to have been infuenced by Cast A Dark Shadow

Roger Moore played both hero and villian in The Man Who Knew To Much

Richard Attenbourgh-Brighton Rock

Diana Dors-Yield To The Night

[Birdy]

Welcome -
I'm not the biggest noir fan on this site, but I do sometimes get irresistably swept to the dark side.
What were the first movies that attracted you to noir and are they still your favorites?
Birdy

[charliechaplinfan]

Well I'm here to learn I hadn't watched many noir films until ast year. Favorite ones The Big Sleep, A Touch of Evil, Sorry Wrong Number, Double Indemnity, they are the better known but I don't think there are any noirs I don't like. I'm ready to know more.

[moirafinnie]

Since Charliechaplinfan brought the subject up. could you please list some essential noirs for a neophyte fan, Karen?

[Gypsy1962]

Good evening, Silver Screen Oasis-ers – it is both a pleasure and a privilege to be here. I have been looking forward to my visit with great anticipation, and I am so appreciative to Moira for her gracious invitation. So let’s see what’s what . . .

As someone whose interest in noir has led to the publication of two books on this topic, (with Femme Noir's release in paperback imminent), could you please offer a brief outline about what sparked your interest in this type of film and why you think it has continued resonance with so many of us?

My interest in film noir started many years ago – more than I care to remember these days – when I was still a teenager, and saw my first film noir. It was Double Indemnity, starring the great Barbara Stanwyck in what I consider to be one of her best roles. I can’t say now, of course, if it was the voiceover narration, or the beautiful black and white cinematography, or the riveting, never boring plot, or the great dialogue – but after I saw it, I was hooked. For good. I’d venture to say that these same qualities attract us to film noir still today. Noir offers some of the best lines in all of filmdom, to me – lines that have been known to make me laugh out loud with delight at their sheer audacity. It also offers memorable characters – beautiful and fearless women you love to hate, men you wouldn’t mind running away with (at least for a few days), even if they did just plug a stranger on a street corner or slap a fellow hood for a stupid remark. Noir offers great plots, with great plot twists – sometimes keeping you guessing until the very end (like, for instance, Mildred Pierce did for me upon my first viewing). There’s just something about the “bad-ness” of it all – perhaps it’s as simple as our own enjoyment at seeing men and women carry out deeds that we’d like – but would never dare – to do ourselves. They just don’t make ‘em like they used to.

[Gypsy1962]

My favorite actor in the style/"genre" is Robert Ryan, so anything you can share about where you place him in the noir universe or any interesting insight you can share about his contributions would be appreciated.

Hi, Miss Goddess!

I share your fondness for Robert Ryan. There was something about his voice, his demeanor, his bearing – he seemed to be someone who wouldn’t take any guff from anybody – and woe unto anyone who’d dare try. It’s funny, but like Ryan once said himself, he portrayed more heroes than villains during his 40-year career, but it’s characters like Earl Pfeiffer in Clash by Night, or Smith Ohrlig in Caught, or Nick Scanlon in The Racket that I remember best.

Ryan was truly a noir staple, appearing in at least 11 features from the era – he’s one of the handful of actors who represent noir to me. Of all of his noir films, my favorites are Act of Violence, where he was genuinely scary as a disabled veteran with a persistent vendetta against an ex war-buddy; Crossfire, where he played Montgomery, a bigoted killer; and Odds Against Tomorrow, in which his performance as a racist bank robber led one critic to comment that he was “a menace who can look bullets and smile sulphuric acid.” Ironically, as much as I enjoyed his villain roles, my favorite Ryan movie was The Set-Up, where he was outstanding as an aging, down-on-his-luck, never-say-die prize fighter. The Set-Up was an ideal vehicle for Ryan’s ability to portray both sensitivity and strength, vulnerability and courage. For his performance as Stoker Thompson, described by one character as “one punch away from being punch-drunk,” Ryan was universally hailed by critics and turned in what I consider to be his best performance.

[Gypsy1962]

I'm from the UK and I'm trying to think of UK bad boys and girls of the genre . . .

Hi, Stuart!

I'm no expert on the bad boys and girls on your side of the pond, but I've done a little research and found a few films that I'd like to see myself. These include It Always Rains on Sunday, starring Googie Withers (who was great in Night and the City); Dear Murderer, with Eric Portman and Maxwell Reid; The Small Back Room, starring David Farrar; Madeleine, with Ann Todd (who also starred in So Evil, My Love with Ray Milland); Bedelia, with Margaret Lockwood; The October Man with John Mills; On the Night of the Fire, starring the always-riveting Ralph Richardson; Hell is a City, with Stanley Baker and Donald Pleasance; and They Drive By Night, with Emlyn Williams (not to be confused with the Humphrey Bogart -George Raft film of the same name).

[MissGoddess]

Thank you so much for your reply on Ryan. I agree about The Set-Up. This, and On Dangerous
Ground are to me his strongest, most complex and emotional performances.

Several of those Brit Noirs you expressed interest in were recently screened at New York's Film Forum.
I got to see only a couple of James Mason thrillers, but it was a very interesting lineup.

What do you think of The Reckless Moment? I absolutely love this film. Joan Bennett and
James Mason gave me the biggest surprise when I first saw it. I always admired both stars,
but never had they moved me emotionally as they did in this marvelous film by director Max
Opuls. how I wish TCM would air it, or they would release it on DVD here in the states. There's
a beautiful print out there, and it was released overseas. Which leads me to another question,
if I may ask: What do you consider some of the most under appreciated films noir?

[Gypsy1962]

Well I'm here to learn I hadn't watched many noir films until ast year. Favorite ones The Big Sleep, A Touch of Evil, Sorry Wrong Number, Double Indemnity, they are the better known but I don't think there are any noirs I don't like. I'm ready to know more.

Hi, CharlieChaplinFan!

I envy you for not having seen many noirs yet – think of all the treasures that you have yet to unearth!

Sorry, Wrong Number is bit of a sentimental favorite for me – it’s another one of those films that I first saw during my teen years. I remember watching it with my mother, and although I didn’t fully appreciate it all of its nuances at the time, I loved every minute and was scared out of my wits at the end (a scene that stayed with me for years!) Touch of Evil also holds a special place in my heart. I first saw it when I was in my 20s – I’d never even heard of it until the owner of my local video store insisted that I rent it. I reluctantly took his advice, if only to get him off my back, and I sure was glad I did. (To this day, I am known to tell one of my children when they’re looking disheveled or their hair is uncombed, ala Marlene Dietrich, “You’re a mess, honey.”)

[moirafinnie]

Ha! I thought that you were going to quote that line "You should lay off those candy bars." I've been known to tape a picture of Orson in this role in Touch of Evil to my bathroom mirror to remind me to curb my hunger! Thanks so much for your answers, Karen. I don't think I had a clue about Double Indemnity's power until I was well into adulthood, even though it had been on tv many times during my childhood. You must have been precocious.

I am very interested in two actresses whose careers had a meteoric quality in and out of film noir.

One of the most interesting chapters of your book on women of noir was the detailed look at Helen Walker. Most people ascribe her brief, dazzling rise, most memorably appearing as Lilith in Nightmare Alley, and her subsequent rapid fall, to that accident that occurred when she gave some servicemen a ride. Do you think it was more complex than that?

Could you please comment on the haunting Gail Russell as a key female figure in film noir of a very different variety than Walker?

Thank you.

[Gypsy1962]

Since Charliechaplinfan brought the subject up. could you please list some essential noirs for a neophyte fan, Karen?

I love this question, Moira! One of the best times I can recall in my film noir-loving life was about 10 years ago when I introduced a young co-worker to film noir. It was not only great fun for me to watch his growing affinity for the era, but I also had a good time just selecting the movies! For the neophyte noir watcher, I hereby submit in no particular order, the following: Double Indemnity (naturally), The Postman Always Rings Twice, Mildred Pierce, Ace in the Hole (AKA The Big Carnival), Criss Cross, The Strange Love of Martha Ivers, The Killers, The Killing, The Big Heat, Born to Kill, This Gun for Hire, They Live By Night, Laura, Gun Crazy, Detour, Gilda, Out of the Past, Nora Prentiss, Scarlet Street, The Set-Up, The Narrow Margin, Sudden Fear, and Sunset Boulevard. I could go on and on and on – and I’m sure I’ll remember something later tonight that will make me smack my forehead in disbelief – but I think this list will certainly give the noir newcomer plenty to chew on for a start.

[Gypsy1962]

What do you think of The Reckless Moment? I absolutely love this film. Joan Bennett and
James Mason gave me the biggest surprise when I first saw it. . . I always admired both stars,
but never had they moved me emotionally as they did in this marvelous film by director Max
Opuls. how I wish TCM would air it, or they would release it on DVD here in the states. There's
a beautiful print out there, and it was released overseas. Which leads me to another question,
if I may ask: What do you consider some of the most under appreciated films noir?

Miss Goddess, I’ve seen many films noirs numerous times, but The Reckless Moment is one that I’ve seen only once. Still, I remember it well. Both Joan Bennett and James Mason were outstanding in their roles, and I love the way the movie opens with scenes of homespun domesticity and turns into a tension-filled, relentless nightmare.

As for underappreciated films noir, I can think of the following, off the top of my head: Desperate (a small noir, but a good showcase for Steve Brodie), The Damned Don’t Cry (one of my favorite Joan Crawford noirs), Detective Story (dismissed by some as too stagy, but I love it), The Prowler (seldom mentioned but an outstanding feature), Plunder Road (another small noir, but a near-perfect one), New York Confidential (one of my personal favorites but, sadly, almost impossible to get – my copy is grainy and jumpy, but I’ve still seen it countless times), Cry of the City (offers a plethora of unforgettable characters, topped off by the always wonderful Richard Conte), Drive a Crooked Road (a good solid Mickey Rooney starrer), Cry Vengeance (starring and directed by Mark Stevens, and featuring a scene that actually moved me to tears), Loophole (which features a great performance by Charles McGraw as a relentless if ill-directed bonding company investigator), City that Never Sleeps (which I’ve actually seen only once but remember fondly – and may just dust off tonight and watch again!), Rogue Cop (where, for my money, Robert Taylor is seen in his best noir performance), and Road House (which contains some of those lines, delivered here by the great Ida Lupino, that make me laugh out loud!)

[Gypsy1962]

One of the most interesting chapters of your book on women of noir was the detailed look at Helen Walker. Most people ascribe her brief, dazzling rise, most memorably appearing as Lilith in Nightmare Alley, and her subsequent rapid fall, to that accident that occurred when she gave some servicemen a ride. Do you think it was more complex than that?

Could you please comment on the haunting Gail Russell as a key female figure in film noir of a very different variety than Walker?

How interesting that you mention Gail Russell and Helen Walker, Moira. Both were such tragic figures in real life – in addition, as you might know, the shy and vulnerable Gail Russell suffered from a drinking problem and, according to actress Yvonne DeCarlo, it was Helen Walker who “took Gail under her wing and introduced her to the tranquilizing benefits of vodka.”

In addition to Nightmare Alley, Helen Walker also turned in a standout performance in Impact, where she starred with Brian Donlevy as a murderer in devoted wife’s expensive clothing. For those who haven’t read about the accident you mentioned, Helen Walker was driving from Palm Springs to L.A. on New Year’s Eve 1946 when she gave a life to a soldier and two other hitchhikers. Near Redland, California, Walker’s car hit a dividing island and turned over six times, and the soldier was killed. Manslaughter charges against Walker were later dropped, but she was sued by both of the other drivers, one charging that she was intoxicated and had been travelling at more than 90 miles an hour when the accident occurred. Walker was confined to a hospital for several weeks, having suffered a broken pelvis and collarbone – as a result, she was replaced by Marjorie Reynolds in a film she’d just started, Heaven Only Knows. Although she was featured in the next three years in Nightmare Alley, Call Northside 777, and Impact, these films represented the beginning of the end. In addition to the deadly accident (which must have been a terrible cross to bear, despite the fact that she was absolved of all guilt), Walker became increasingly reliant on alcohol, made a bad marriage with a department store executive after an eight-month courtship, and suffered the loss of all of her possessions in a house fire. By the time she appeared in her last noir, The Big Combo, in 1955, she was all but unrecognizable, and she died at the age of 47.

Gail Russell, who also died young, less than a month before her 37th birthday, was seen in four films noirs: Calcutta, Moonrise, Night Has a Thousand Eyes, and The Tattered Dress. In contrast to the hard-hearted, steely characters for which Walker was known, Gail Russell more often played delicate, fragile, vulnerable creatures that seemed to be close to her own personality. Of these three films, she only had one true “bad girl” role – in Calcutta, she portrayed a sweet-faced murderer who is part of a jewel smuggling ring. Also, in The Tattered Dress, she is driven to murder, but only after suffering humiliation and degradation at the hands of her lover. It is her role in Night Has a Thousand Eyes that seems to represent the quintessential Russell – she plays a terrified heiress whose attempted suicide opens the film.