Fred and Ginger - in order

[charliechaplinfan]

This festive season I've decided to revisit all the Astaire Rogers movies in order. I've never watched them as a whole, one after another but dipped in and out of them over the years and always promised myself that I would one day watch them in the order they were made.

Yesterday I started with Flying Down to Rio, I wonder how much planning went into putting this partnership together the partnership of Astaire and Rogers, they play second fiddle here to Dolores del Rio and Gene Raymond, Raymond doesn't come across very well to me, his type just seems a bit too dated to me, Dolores Del Rio is definetly a first string star and the plot revolves around the lovely Belinha. Ginger is wise cracking and Fred plays an accordian in the band and conducts when his friend, Gene Raymond goes off after the girls. It's basic plot has nothing to set it apart from other vehicles of the day, apart from the fledgling partnership of Astaire and Rogers, a head connecting dance routine and the only dance routine I've seen with aeroplanes. Coming after Hell's Angels, Wings and Lindberg crossing the Atlantic, flying was a hot topic and Rio De Janerio an exotic setting. Fred's character was called Fred Ayres, very similar to his own name, perhaps to capitalise on the fame he already had achieved. According to Fred's filmography this is the first film he made, I'd always thought it was Dancing Lady, no matter, if this was his first movie he scored an absolute hit. Ginger had been playing a similar role in other movies but here she finds her niche which adds more panache to the wisecracking gal that she's so good at portraying. Dolores Del Rio gets a chance to dance with Fred, just a small chance but it was very nice.

The Gay Divorcee and the Fred and Ginger magic is shoved right to the fore, based on a stage play of the same name, it pits Fred falling for Ginger straight away against Ginger who is sore at him for tearing her dress at their first meeting. Also introduced are two other features that are prerequistes of Astaire/Rogers films, that of the delightful supporting players, here we have Edward Everett Horton, Erik Blore and Alice Brady to name three, all playing their crack pot characters so well that the developing confusion and double meanings are easily believeable. The other thing so important thing that spells out a Astaire/Rogers flim is the art deco sets, so stylish with clean lines that appear to imhabit a world all of their own that I would love to inhabit just for a day to wander around. Of course the set pieces of this film are Needle in a Haystack which Fred dances alone and much as I'm a fan of Fred's solo dances it's what he does with a partner in his arms that really makes me melt. Night and Day, he woos Ginger who has been completely resistant to him up to this point and keeps trying to walk away from him but gets blocked by his body whilst he sings the lyrics to her again and again, slowly she weakens, giving in to his charm, his words and his way with her. Watch Ginger's face, so much goes through it as he sings, then watch her body as she dances with him, willing and pliant but ready to match him movie for move. It's utterly charming, a seduction routine, Ginger really does make Fred sexy, it's not just Katharine Hepburn who said that although I would say he is sexy at this point in his career but Ginger makes him really hot. Fred does give her class, not in terms of the fact that she needs him to give her the illusion of class but because in these films she's elevated about the showgirl/shopgirl/streetwise gilr she's played time and again and given a step up in society. Lastly we have the Continental, suggestive, a kiss whilst you're dancing, a set piece, partly danced by Fred and Ginger aand partly danced by a number of dancers, slightly reminscient of Berkeleys number's at Warners, showing the dancers from different angles, making patterns. Fred and Ginger don't dance for long but when they do it's full of joy with Ginger having a scarf in her hand for added effect. The dance is a mixture of many types, I spotted latin, waltz and charleston and I'm no expert but these melded very well into the dance as a whole. 15 minutes went very quickly. The film is finished off by a lovely lot of confusion, all the scenes with the correspondent are well timed and acted, the characters who add to the confusion being amongst the best supporting actors to grace a film. This has always been one of my favourite Fred and Ginger movies because of the freshness, I wonder if I'll still feel this way when I've finished my journey.

[Rita Hayworth]

I seen everyone of these movies except Wings and I find them very well made; you have written an excellent chronological recap of these movies and I enjoyed reading it the 2nd time around so I can go back to see what movies that I missed and seen in the rundown of all the Astaire/Rogers films that you've mentioned here. I watched some of these films again on Turner Classic Movies just recently and I enjoy them immensely.

Flying Down to Rio and The Gay Divorcee are my two favorites Astaire/Rogers films that they made together. They were fantastic together!

Again, thanks for taking the time to write this up and I only wished Astaire/Hayworth made as much movies as Astaire/Rogers did back in those days of where I think movies were kings and queens!

I only wished that Hollywood starts making musicals again! We need another generation of Gene Kelly, Fred Astaire, Ginger Rogers, Rita Hayworth, and all those legendary dancers that graced the Silver Screen one and/or two generations ago!

[charliechaplinfan]

It would be a dream wouldn't it to have a return to musicals, no doubt they are more expensive to film but I liked Chicago and Moulin Rouge and they did well at the box office, it might take me back to the pictures again if musicals reappear, as it is I watch most movies once they come to DVD as the costs of watching movies is quite expensive, I would pay it for a musical though, I would pay it to watch one of yesterday's musicals on the big screen too.

Some of the Fred and Ginger musicals I've only seen once, Carefree, Roberta and The Story of Vernon and Irene Castle, I found the later film to be a bit of a let down because it is a break from the style that had gone before, I wonder watching it again if I'd feel the same way, perhaps by the time I get to Carefree I'd want a break from the formula. I've always said my favourite is Swing Time and my favourite dance being 'Pick Yourself Up' and from someone who adores Ginger's outfits, in this routine she's clad in skirt and blouse, still very stylish but not in the beautiful gowns that are styled, I'm sure, to flow in time with the dance.

If I have a criticism of these films it is that Fred gets plenty of solo dance time, I would like to have seen a little more of Ginger being showcased. I'm no dancer but it always looks harder to do everything in heels and backwards.

[charliechaplinfan]

Robertais the last of the Fred and Ginger movies I ever saw for the simple reason that it has never been released, so watching it in order of the Fred and Ginger body of work sort of reset it in my mind.

After the second billing of Flying Down to Rio then the successful teaming of them in The Gay Divorcee it's hard to understand why they were put in a film to play if not second fiddle but equalt partners to Irene Dunne and Randolph Scott. Irene is the opposite of the fake Ginger, understated glamour whereas when we first meet Ginger she is overbearing playing a ridiculous character who is laying into poor Irene who plays Roberta's assistant. Roberta's is a fashion house in Paris were the four protaganists meet, Fred being Randolph Scott's best friend who has come to Paris with his band being mistakenly hired as Red Indians and not the Indiana's that they are and also in the role of Randolph Scott's friend, there he meets the Russian countess who he knows from back home, caught out Ginger has to admit to her deception, done to acquire a job singing in a nightclub. Fred and Ginger are the comic foil for the more serious Dunne and Scott, much as I like Dunne and she is very good as the emigre Russian princess I don't think this is Scott's best momoent, he seems ill at ease.

There is plenty music in Roberta but it is split between Irene Dunne and Fred and Ginger, I learnt that it wasn't only me who finds Dunne's style of singing a little outdated, my hubby didn't appreciate her at all. For me rather I'd have the Russian accented singing of Ginger or the deft way Astaire handles a song. Our first dance they dance as friends, both dressed in slacks very stylishly and the dance is a dance of old pals, gently teasing and getting reacquainted with one another. The second dance is simply stunning, Ginger is dressed in black with a diamante head band over the crown of her head, very simple, very effective and as Astaire dances with her he cradles her head, it's so romantic and this isn't our romantic couple, they've teased and been pals all the way through but discovered that the childish crush they had on one another back home has not gone away. Randolph gets Irene too but somehow that takes second place.

The fashions are also central to this film, many outfits are shown on fashion models and on Ginger and Irene, Irene gets the chance to wear a beautiful crown and then Randy doesn't get that she's Russsian royalty and Ginger she has some gorgeous outfits. All said although it is a good movie it is one of the secondary films of the Fred and Ginger collection for me simply because I'd rather have more dances and more camera time of Fred and Ginger.

[Rita Hayworth]

The fashions are also central to this film, many outfits are shown on fashion models and on Ginger and Irene, Irene gets the chance to wear a beautiful crown and then Randy doesn't get that she's Russsian royalty and Ginger she has some gorgeous outfits. All said although it is a good movie it is one of the secondary films of the Fred and Ginger collection for me simply because I'd rather have more dances and more camera time of Fred and Ginger.

What you've written here is exactly how I feel about that movie. I read your post twice and when I read your last paragraph here ... its hits me right in the head. I have nothing against Randolph Scott and Irene Dunne ... but this movie should had the spotlight on Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers instead.

Randolph Scott and Irene Dunne should had played second fiddle to Fred and Ginger.

I totally agree with you 100% that more dances and camera time to Fred and Ginger.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on Fred and Ginger on your thread ... I love it!

[charliechaplinfan]

Thanks, we've talked many times on Fred and Ginger in various threads but I'm not sure we've ever devoted a thread to them.

I have only seen Randolph Scott in the earlier movies, I've never watched him in a Western which I can tell he'd be more at home, I have to admit that he doesn't do very much for me, he's personified for me as the other guy in My Favourite Wife. I have grown to really like Irene Dunne, I think she's a really talented actress with many facets to her screen personality, even if I don't like her singing I like about everything else about her, she has such an easy grace even when she is in screwball situations.

It does puzzle me that hitting on a formula with The Gay Divorcee RKO then stepped backwards and shared screen time, my guess is that it had the rights to Roberta and it killed two birds with one stone to use the musical and the four talents here. Although in Follow The Fleet would have a second couple from my memory it is very much Fred and Ginger's movie.

[knitwit45]

Alison, sorry to hear you've been unwell. Hope things are turning around for you now.
Have you seen Dunne in "I Remember Mama"? She completely 'tosses away' the Irene Dunne persona, and becomes a lovely middle-aged Norwegian mama.

now back to Fred and Ginger!

[Rita Hayworth]

More thoughts from kingme ... KM

Thanks, we've talked many times on Fred and Ginger in various threads but I'm not sure we've ever devoted a thread to them.

KM ... I don't think so!?!? ... This could be the 1st.

I have grown to really like Irene Dunne, I think she's a really talented actress with many facets to her screen personality, even if I don't like her singing I like about everything else about her, she has such an easy grace even when she is in screwball situations.

KM ... I adore Dunne ... she's a favorite of mine and should had her voice dubbed just like Columbia Pictures did for Rita Hayworth. I grown to love her with the Charles Boyer's films that I seen earlier this year.

Have you seen Dunne in "I Remember Mama"? She completely 'tosses away' the Irene Dunne persona, and becomes a lovely middle-aged Norwegian mama.

KM ... Knitty ... I love I Remember Mama ... she was Wonderful in that Movie!

[charliechaplinfan]

I Remember Mama was a real eye opeer for me, she completely stepped out of the role of Irene Dunne ad into the shoes of that Norwegian Mama.

I think we've discussed the films on the general threads but never as a whole body of work. I've always admired the dancing of Fred Astaire and found him completely enjoyable in all his movies but it's Gene Kelly who made the quicker impact on me, I still love Gene and thankfully his character and dancing is such that there was room for both Fred and Gene, they were complimentary rather than direct rivals. Gene dazzled both in dance and looks, Fred appeals in a very different way, he exists in a world of manners and sophistication and is usually a musician, showman or playboy, it's not a world we inhabit but it sparkles and he gives it it's veneer of gentlemanly gloss. I've watched an awful lot of Fred's movies, not all yet I find I am constantly reappraising his work, it's so polished and the fact that he kept it going for so many years, managing to play against younger and younger women without being out of place as their suitors, playing essentially the same character but never boring his audience. His way with a lyric is second to none, he serenades his ladies with such sincerity. watching the younger Fred in this series it's really brings all this home to me, this and the fact that after his work with Ginger he mainly worked with actresses who were a good deal younger. Ginger I know was younger but to me it doesn't feel as apparent.

[charliechaplinfan]

I rewatched Top Hat and enjoyed it even more, if that is possible. I think here they really hit their stride, Venice doesn't look like this, beautiful though it is I'd like to take a trip to this Venice, it looks so much fun. The routines here are sublime, both Fred's solos and the duets, Ginger's character is honed to perfection, she falls for him pretty quickly but manages to keep up the slightly sardonic air being completely seduced by the way the dances and sings to her, she's completely hooked, his charm has completely cut through her reserve and then a mistake of identity that is kept up for a great deal of them film, never flagging in, getting plenty of mileage whilst keeping the couple estranged.

Everything comes together in such a beautiful package, credit has to be given here for some of the best supporting actors of the thirties, Edward Everett Horton, Eric Blore, Erik Rhodes each inhabiting their parts like gloves, giving the mistake credence by their general buffoonery. Only Fred and Ginger operate as sane people in this world. The script is witty, the songs, divine.

Does anyone know were the songs written specifically for Astaire in these movies? Or were the movies written around the songs, I think Astaire has had songs written for him in the past for stage but did he for these movies? They fit his style like a glove.

My DVD has an intro by his daughter, not born at the time of these movies but she repeated the story of the feathered dress and also how her father, a mild mannered man lost his temper and how they both had to dance together until the feathers stopped coming off the dress, both getting tired. One has to have a little sympathy here with Ginger, she had nothing to do with the choreography but did have a say in her outfits, as a woman I can apprecaite the love of a dress. it says a lot that Fred sent Ginger a lovely gold charm for her bracelet, a feather and nice not to Feathers saying I love you. His daughter also said there was no truth that they didn't like one another, they did.

[charliechaplinfan]

Just had a quick look at the imdb about Fred and Ginger here's something Fred said about Ginger.

Ginger was brilliantly effective. She made everything work for her. Actually, she made things very fine for the both of us and she deserves most of the credit for our success

I also enjoyed a quote by Tony Martin he said he could always tell who Cyd had danced with by the bruises on her body. If she'd been bruised it was the physically demanding Gene Kelly, if not it was Fred.

[intothenitrate]

Hey CCF. Thanks for starting this series.

The F&G films hold a special place in my heart. Those films--plus the Goldiggers movies--really lifted my spirits during a particularly glum period in my life a few years back. Whenever I watch them now--especially the ones with Edward Everett Horton et. al.--it's like visiting old friends.

On one of my recordings, Robert Osborne says that Fred's contract stipulated that he would get one solo dance number per film. The reason was (as he put it), "So at least once the audience would be watching me."

Which film is it where they meet in a gazebo during a rainstorm? They do an Irving Berlin number called Isn't this a Lovely Day (to be caught in the rain). I've made ukulele and guitar arrangements for that song. It's a brilliant piece.

Bon chance on your journey. I'll be looking forward to reading more. (And I'll have to dig out my copy of Roberta and give that another look.)

[Fossy]

Roberta (1935)

Robertais the last of the Fred and Ginger movies I ever saw for the simple reason that it has never been released . I think that this may be incorrect, I have this moviein my collection, so it must have been released.

I learnt that it wasn't only me who finds Dunne's style of singing a little outdated, my hubby didn't appreciate her at all.

What do you expect? Of course the singing is outdated. This movie was released on 8 March 1935. That`s over 76 years ago. Irene was a trained soprano, who also sang operatic arias. Ginger`s singing style was totally different and could not be compared to Irene`s. ( I am biased, and have previously indicated that I am partial to sopranos).

In this film I believe that Irene`s performance was better than Ginger`s. Fred was just ok, and Randolph`s performance was mediocre.

Just in case you think I am biased toward one or the other, I regard both as great actresses, Irene as the better singer, Ginger as the better dancer. My collection includes 32 of Irene`s films and 37 of Ginger`s.

[charliechaplinfan]

Intothenitrate,they danced under the gazebo in Top Hat, Ginger is clad in jodphurs as she's been out riding. It's a lovely sequence, very romantic. I'm glad these movies cheered you, along with the Golddigger series, I think these were made at a time when the populace needed glamour, humour, song and dance, the fact they still have the ability to cheer is a testament to all the talent involved. For me these movies are reminiscient of Xmas time, they were broadcast in the mornings some years ago in between Xmas and New Year, before wide spread DVDs some I'd never seen before, for me they will always hold a festive feeling.

Fossy, I think you must have misunderstood me, Roberta hadn't been released as a region 2, I had to import a copy, it was the only film of the whole set that I couldn't get hold of in the UK, it seemed pretty strange to be unable to get the one film. As for Irene Dunne, I like almost everything about classic films, their outdatednes and Irene Dunne, I wish I could take to her style of singing because the earlier version Showboat is the superior version, the consolation with the later being that I only like Kathryn Grayson's singing voice only marginally more than Irene Dunne's singing voice. Irene might be a better singer than Ginger but for me Ginger is the pleasanter to listen to. Irene makes an interesting contrast to Ginger, I like both ladies and have countless films with them in, I just adore Fred and Ginger, particularly together.

[charliechaplinfan]

Follow the Fleet isn't up there as one of the greats of the series, at least not in the movie books I've read, sandwiched as it is between Top Hat and Swing Time but it's ranked as one of my favourites from first viewing. It turns the formula a little on it's head, Fred and Ginger are old dancing partners, a little like in Roberta, there is no chaos that ensues around them, rather Fred creates it, particularly distracting for Ginger who he manages to lose jobs for twice. Fred isn't the elegant top hat and tails character but a sailor, albeit a very smart one.

We are treated to more musical numbers from the opening We're in the Navy' to solos for Ginger 'Let Yourself Go' and her only solo tap dancing number, Harriet Hilliard takes some of the solo numbers. There's a real exuberance in the numbers, they dance as pals, to Let Yourself Go and I'm Putting All My Eggs on One Basket show the comic timings and abilities of the dancer and cheorgrapher, Ginger is allowed to get the better of Fred in the numbers too. The story has two pair of lovers as in Roberta and Randolph Scott returns as Fred's pal, Harriet Hilliard plays Ginger's school teacher sister, Fred and Ginger used to be a dance act but he joined the navy when she turned down his marriage proposal to further her career, a decision she regrets. However life is a bit up and down for both couples, not running smooth until the final reel.

We can see Fred playing the piano, something he loved to do, teaching dance classes to sailors and having a monkey as a pet, he's great in this change of direction, although he does have a touch of Stan Laurel about him when he grins broadly (thanks hubby). Despite all the teasing and kidding around and the time spent in sailor suits Fred does don top hat and tails to dance one of my favourite dances with Ginger to 'Let's Face the Music and Dance' which is staged for a show, Ginger pretending to try to commit suicide but is enticed by Fred's hypnotic dance. It's sublime, Ginger in her best costume looking a million dollars. A completely adorable addition to the cannon.

This film also had an introduction by Ava Astaire, she tells us how the Brits censored 'Get Me Behind thee Satan' to remove the Satan making nonsense of the song. She also tells of another wardrobe malfunction, where Ginger's heavily beaded dress smacks Fred in the face, something only noticeable because we can stop the film, Fred insisted on 20 retakes but the first is the one they used. Lucille Ball, Betty Grable ans Tony martin can all be glimpsed as extras.

Follow the Fleet a real feel good movie.