Nell - Eleanor Doheny....

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Vecchiolarry
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Nell - Eleanor Doheny....

Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi,

Alison asked about my grandmother and I will start this but won't expand too much as Nell wasn't a movie star.
I have put her in "People of Film" though because she did 'produce' some TV shows in the 50's. By 'produce', I mean she threw money at them and then balked when thwarted.....

Maria Eleanor Doheny.
Camarillo, California.
February 2, 1890 - March 30, 1965.

Married:
1) HH Prince Matvei Cantacuzene - St. Petersburg, Russia - 1908 - 1914 (marriage annulled by Russian Orthodox Church for failure to produce children)....
2) HIH Prince Gavril Constantinovich Romanov - Paris, France - 1914 - 1916 (divorced)....
3) Marquis Norman de Serraincourt, Count de Mortain - Rouen, France - 1916 - 1925 (divorced)....
4) HRH Prince Aimone Aosta de Savoy, Duke of Spoleto, Duke of Apulia & Duke of Aosta - Turin, Italy - 1926 - 1936 (marriage annulled by Roman Catholic Church for failure to produce children)

#3 was my grandfather; my father is now 90 and lives here in Calgary - 4 blocks from me (I have barely spoken to him in 40 years)... My mother is also 90 and I barely see her either.
You may ascertain that we have issues!!

Nell returned to USA (first to New York City and then Los Angeles) in 1936; she never married again but had "gentlemen callers" (several)...

In 1938, my father & his sister left LA and ran away to Canada. He joined the Canadian army and I was born in 1942.
In 1946, my parents sent me to LA because Nell had never seen me and demanded a 'visit'; she kept me "hostage" with frequent trips to Europe until 1957, when I went to Germany to Heidelberg University.


She left Russia before WWI in April 1914 but continued to visit the Dowager Empress until she died in 1928. Nell attended her funeral in Denmark.
I attended her re-burial in St. Petersburg in 2006 and wrote about it at TCM's message board ("From Russia with Love")...... I don't know if it's still available.

Well, that's the bare bones!!


Alison et al,
If you want to know more about Nell, you'll need to ask questions. It's all very confusing, I know - - even at 66, I'm still confused!!

Larry
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knitwit45
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Post by knitwit45 »

Hi Larry. Thanks for starting this thread. Did Grandmother Nell (seems disrespectful to just say "Nell") have any children with husband #2? Was he the one she nursed in Mexico from the wounds he received as a POW? Can you tell us a bit about her time in Russia at the Imperial Court? How did she get to Russia in the first place?


Inquiring minds want to know!!!!
klondike

Post by klondike »

Hey, Larry! :)
Cool thread, keep it going by all means!
Was about to make a big assumption, but will play safe & ask: is the reason you reside in Canada now, because of your late folks' residency, and/or being born there yourself?
As I've mentioned before, your neck o' the woods is sure lovely to the eye, the Lake Louise area in particular being absolutely stunning; I wouldn't mind visiting there again some day!
Vecchiolarry
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Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi Nancy & Klondike,

Yes, I love this area and am often in Banff & Lake Louise.

I was born in Canada - in Prince Albert, Saskatchewan, where my mother is from.
I lived there in my other grandparent's house for 4 years, while my father was away in Europe during WWII. He was in the Canadian army.
I came back here to Canada in 1964, because as an adult now, I would lose my Canadian citizenship if I continued on in USA.


Nell & her sister Carrie were sent to Europe in 1900 by their father for education, first to Geneva and then Paris.
In Paris, they met the Dowager Empress of Russia and her sister, Britain's Queen Alexandra at the Paris Exhibition and the DE sponsored them both to go to the Smolny Institute in St. Petersburg. The DE was Patroness of the Institute.

After graduation in 1908, Nell went to work in the DE's Houshold and married her Chevalier (which is equivelent to Master of the Horse in the British monarchy).. Nell therefore became Chatelaine of the Household.
She accompanied Maria Feodorovna nearly everywhere in public but was not required much in the private life.

No, Nell had no children with Gaby Romanov. She was married only 3 weeks to him in 1914, when he returned to Russia at the start of WWI. She finally divorced him in 1916 and married my grandfather the next day. Gaby did survive & escape and I met him a couple of times in Paris. He married 2 more times but had no children. He died in 1955.
Her first husband was murdered by the Bolsheviks in 1918. Shot in the forests near Tobulsk.

My grandfather was the one Nell nursed in Vera Cruz in 1941.
He was with the French resistance and captured by the Nazis; the Gestapo shot both his knees out and broke his legs; they kicked out all his teeth.
He was rescued by the French and British and sent to Portugal and then by ambulance plane to Mexico, hoping to get to America.
Constance Bennett & Gilbert Roland found him by accident and phoned Nell to come down. He died there at the end of January 1941, three weeks after arriving...
Constance had been previously married to my grandfather's cousin, Marquis de la Falaise de Coudray.
When I first went to LA in 1946, Nell was preparing to go to Europe and re-bury my grandfather from Vera Cruz in Rouen and he is now there in the Cathedral. Nell had a beautiful alabaster statue of him placed over his coffin. He looks beautiful.

Larry
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Birdy
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Post by Birdy »

What do you mean Constance Bennett and Gilbert Roland found him? I can't believe these things come rolling across just like I would say, " I saw the preacher at Walmart."

If you have the time and energy, please tell us more about her. What was her personal style? Did she have a sense of humor? (I'm guessing yes, with 4 marriages.) We'd love to hear a story or two about experiences with her. I hope you don't wear out your fingers and your keyboard - you are like a living history book. I'm so fascinated by my own family and community members stories, but yours are so widespread and involve so many famous people. Please keep sharing.
B
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mrsl
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Post by mrsl »

I'm so happy to see this over here. Remember I told you I read every word from Russia? I doubt anyone would care if you did this more often.

Anne
Anne


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* * * * * * * * What is past is prologue. * * * * * * * *

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Lzcutter
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Post by Lzcutter »

Larry,

If you would consider writing more of your memories of Nell and others, those of us celebrating birthdays this week would consider it the best birthday gift of all.

Now if I could just remember the movie I saw within the last two weeks. I was watching television and there was this great establishing shot of Doheny mansion and I said to Mr. Cutter, "Babe, look it's Doheny mansion. I should tell Larry."

And Mr C being the wit he is replied "Who's Larry?"

And I said, "He's someone I know whose relatives built Doheny mansion."

And Mr. Cutter said "You know too many people but he is probably a good one to know" and then he smiled his mega-watt smile.

You have to come to Los Angeles or Las Vegas one of these days.
Lynn in Lake Balboa

"Film is history. With every foot of film lost, we lose a link to our culture, to the world around us, to each other and to ourselves."

"For me, John Wayne has only become more impressive over time." Marty Scorsese

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Vecchiolarry
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Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi,

Lynn -
Do you mean Greystone Manor in Beverly Hills?
I don't think they let people film the Doheny Mansion on Chester Street - the nuns there would get their wimples in a knot!!
Greystone has been used in many movies over the years - it belonged to my Aunt Lucy but she sold it to Beverly Hills in the late 50's.

Birdy -
I think Constance Bennett & Gilbert Roland were in Vera Cruz getting her divorce from her French Marquis when they heard about a French Marquis badly wounded in a hospital there. It turned out to be my grandfather, whom Constance knew very well.
She cared for him and called Nell, who nursed him but to no avail. Nell was a full fledged nurse - that's something every girl was taught at the Smolny Institute. She nursed me through measles, mumps and chicken pox and she was very caring to the sick and needy.
She gave away hundreds of thousands of dollars to hospitals and charities.

As to her personality:
She was blonde, blue eyed, slim and quite a beauty. She held her looks (a more matured look) until she died at 75...
If you combine Mae Murray, Lana Turner & Claire Trevor - you would have a close resemblance to Nell.

She was a woman of few words really, but lots of action. She walked fast and straight ahead and you got out of her way. My governess, Laura, who brought her up from infancy (and brought up her sister, my father & his sister & me) called her "a steamroller".....
She did most things with hand signals - - right hand & index finger meant 'come here now' (but I like you & you are OK); - - left hand and index finger meant 'get over here now' (and you're in trouble)...
Similarly, if she shooed you away with her right - then OK but if it was with her left - Oh, oh!!!

You could not just go into her area of the house (28 rooms - some huge); you must be summoned; she ruled the east wing, I had the west wing (which I did not rule, she did also). She was not a woman one could run to and hug or sit on her knee like a regular granny. One approached and then when offered her cheek, you kissed it..... She would however, often hold my hand when talking to me or having tea or sometimes (not often) breakfast...
Everyone dressed for dinner and I always sat at her right.
My nickname was 'CP', which at first I thought was Canadian Pacific after the railway here; but it meant Crown Prince, as Nell never corrected the wrong impression in the US that she was a royal princess. Her last husband was an Italian Royal Highness and she just kept on keepin' on with that appallation......

She was the first to call herself ‘a b-i-t-c-h’ and once, I overheard her on the phone with Martha Raye saying, “Oh you think you’re a b-i-t-c-h, well I’m a bigger B-I-T-C-H”……

As for knowing famous people - I never knew they were famous until about 1954 when we got a TV.
I always thought that the only movie star was Roy Rogers, who I saw in the movies.
Then, on TV I suddenly spotted Loretta Young and said, "That's Aunt Gretch!!"..... Also, that year Loretta Young took sick and was off the air for weeks and several of her pals pitched in to host her show - - and there was Merle Oberon, Ann Sothern, Irene Dunne and Rosalind Russell. Then, Theda Bara died and there was much hoopla about her and her funeral was on the news.
So, then I began asking and reading about the many people I'd known and found out all about them.
Most of these people were not working in movies anymore and the few that were were on their way out by 1956 anyway.

In 1957, I went to Europe for 3 years and when I returned I bought a house in Malibu and never lived with Nell again. And very seldom saw her. I returned to Canada in 1964 and Nell died in 1965.

She had the best death of anyone I've ever known - -
Mae Murray had died and Nell was on her way to the funeral. She came down the stairs into the foyer, where her butler, Herbert, was waiting at the open front door. She dropped dead at his feet, instantly dead.
All poor Herbert could do was utter, "Oh, Madam!"...

Larry
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Lzcutter
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Post by Lzcutter »

Larry,

Thanks so much for writing more about Nell. It is a pleasure to read your reminisces on not only Nell but all the people you have known.

As for Doheny Mansion, it was the one on Chester Street near USC. It was exterior shots but it was definitely Doheny Mansion.

I wish I could remember the name of the movie. It was in color and probably from the 1970s.

It's going to bug me until I remember it!
Lynn in Lake Balboa

"Film is history. With every foot of film lost, we lose a link to our culture, to the world around us, to each other and to ourselves."

"For me, John Wayne has only become more impressive over time." Marty Scorsese

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knitwit45
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Post by knitwit45 »

Larry, do you have any pictures of Miss Nell? It seems like you mentioned she was in a magazine that came out last year, but I never could find it. Do you know any details about her stay at court? What a fascinating time that must have been for a little girl from Sunny California. Did her sister escape before the revolution also?
"Life is not the way it's supposed to be.. It's the way it is..
The way we cope with it, is what makes the difference." ~ Virginia Satir
""Most people pursue pleasure with such breathless haste that they hurry past it." ~ Soren Kierkegaard
Vecchiolarry
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Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi Lynn,

Wow, that's interesting that the Chester Street house was used.

That place was Old Mrs. D's home (Estelle Doheny). It was a little too much with the siena marble & tiffany dome - kind of gaudy, really.

I may get to LA in late May as that's Elaine Stewart's 80th birthday. If I do, I will get together with you & Mr. Cutter....
I am going to England in April and then cruising down the Rhine (or up the Rhine) from Amsterdam to Mainz and then on the Danube to Bucharest in July/August/ September. Then I'm joining some New Zealand friends on a cruise from Istanbul through the Greek Islands to Egypt.
So, I may not go to LA in May but ask Elaine and her hubby, Merrill, to join me on one or both cruises.

I'll let you know.

Larry
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mongoII
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Post by mongoII »

Larry, even though I'm familiar with most of your recollections from past threads on TCM, I still find it facinating o read this.
I'd be interested to know who Nell liked among the Hollywood stars and who she didn't much care for?
Also who were some of her Hollywood lovers other than Steve Cochran?
Dare I ask?
It may sound strange to you, but somehow I like Nell.
Joseph Goodheart
Vecchiolarry
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Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi,

Nancy -
Yes, Nell's sister, Carrie, did leave Russia in 1910 before the revolution.
She settled in Paris until about 1914 and the went to Madrid when she married the Marquis de Portago. She died in 1918 of the Spanish Flu epidemic.
Her husband remarried and their son, also the Marquis de Portago, becamr a famous race car driver who had a big affair with Linda Christian years later. He died in the late 50's in a racing accident.

Joe -
Nell's friends were many included Marion Davies and Hearst and Marion's sister, Rose. Also, Dorothy di Frasso, one of Gary Cooper's girlfriends; she was an Italian Countess too!!
Also, Fanny Brice, Bill & Edie Goetz, Louise Fazenda and Hal Wallis, Adolph Zukor and Ann Spaulding (George Hamilton's mother)...
Nell was quite likeable actually; charming, & gracious. She spoke several languages and loved to tell dirty jokes and make rude comments -eg- after blowing out her 61 birthday candles, she said to Prince Philip when he congratulated her, "I always give a good blow job!!"...

Her dislikes were just a few:
Frank Sinatra, Lucille Ball, Mary Livingston (Sadie Slug) & Dolores Gray.

Two other lovers besides Steve Cochran were Richard Allan (the lover in "Niagara") and Buster Crabbe.
In fact I now have a green enammelled Faberge crab of hers called 'Buster'...

Larry
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mongoII
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Post by mongoII »

Larry, thank you. I'm still laughing at Nell's bithday comment...hilarious.
And to Prince Philip no less.

Did many or any celebrities show up at her funeral?
Vecchiolarry
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Post by Vecchiolarry »

Hi Joe,

James Stewart & Gloria, Hal Wallis, Adolph Zukor, the Young girls and families and Moyna MacGill were there but I can't remember any more.
The funeral was held in her reception room and foyer of her home as she didn't believe in religion(s) and detested priests.
It was a county judge who presided.

She was cremated and her ashes were buried under a newly planted tree on her property.
Her house was sold to Dina Merrill and now belongs to a Brunei prince. Most of her furniture was auctioned off in NYC and Palm Beach but I own her eggs and Russian bric a brac. Much of her paintings went to Paulette Goddard in Switzerland but came back to my youngest brother, who died in 1998 and my father has it all in storage.

Larry
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