ALFRED HITCHCOCK
- JackFavell
- Posts: 11926
- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Great as usual, Maven! I'm with MissG, it's fun to read you. You have a way of encouraging thought about movies you love. I hate to pick and choose through what you write about, there are so many directions of thought here we could go towards. I wish I could address every little thing, but then my post would run on into tomorrow. It probably does anyway! so take this as a ramble induced by your excellent post. Sorry for the length it turned out to be, and the re-iterating of the same points all the way through. I'm too lazy and tired to edit my reply, so here it is such as it is, it's kind of a jumble. You somehow make me think so hard about these things. These thoughts would never come up for me without your posts. And I also should really thank MissG as well for some of the inspiration here, since she discussed Hitch's heroines so brilliantly.
Two of my favorites are on your list, Saboteur and Foreign Correspondent. I like how you tie them together with Hitch's other works, his hints at future or past movies.
I like that you talk about those "just plain Americans" in Hitch's work, Saboteur to be exact. This is what I love most about his films. The normal, simple folks who make a decision and act, not based on a party line or what someone else said, but because they care about human beings. Theresa Wright in Shadow of a Doubt. We could say the real hero of Strangers on a Train is that guy who goes under the merry go round to stop it from spinning wildly and killing children. Of course, it doesn't go as planned, but this is the perfect analogy for Hitch's world view, which is why it stands out as one of Hitch's most famous set pieces, which you also talk about. A description of Hitch's set pieces and what they mean would make a great thesis.
I like that you mention Otto Kruger and James Mason in the same post, as villains extraordinaire. And Martin Landau, for that matter, since I love movies with more than one villain. Otto is the more evil to me than either of the other men, Mason, one can almost feel for. Hitch brings that line in Rules of the Game to life - "The awful thing about life is, everyone has their reasons." We see that a villain is not just a villain but an individual person, someone like the neighbor down the street with children or grandchildren. Or he could be a fiance who can love but who can also kill because he's too much of a capitalist to let his business affairs get away from him. Or a father who hides his past, knowing it's wrong on some level, but stuck because his affluence comes from his playing "the game". Business certainly gets a bad rep from Hitch since it's usually the excuse a villain has for his actions in Hitch's world.
Hitch's villains' actions ripple across our own tight little world in ways we can't even pretend to perceive, much like business, or events in the real world. When they are presented to us on the nightly news we think it doesn't affect us, but when a crash happens right in our own community we become aware. Shockingly aware.
Here's another quote that seems to me relevant to the discussion of Hitch:
Is this the main trait in Hitchcock's films? Alicia Huberman should be more aware of what is happening around her, after all, she's been on the sidelines of political events...but instead she leads a life of dissipation, runs away from any involvement because of the terrible acts of her father. She learns to ACT instead of blindly living day to day. Hitch forces these heroes and heroines to become aware of and to actually ACT to help others. Johnny Jones doesn't care a fig about world events. In fact, he wavers so much in retrospect that he could have propelled America into a sort of slavery to the powers of darkness (never mentioned as Nazis) through no fault of his own, except his simple ignorance. But he comes to know people who are affected by those events, he finds out what's important to him, and he must act upon it...and his girl must make a very similar decision. Lina in Suspicion must become aware that her husband Johnnie is in trouble, to think of him in order to save her marriage. She has to stop seeing how his actions affect HER and see how her actions affect HIM and those around her. Connie must become generous, give up her worldly goods to help others in the Lifeboat. Knowledge breeds heroic action, if you are willing to give up something for your fellow man.
The heroes of Hitch are remarkably like his villains, no wonder they are always being mistaken for them. A villain, according to Hitch, is one who can use the system for their own gain, like a child with a ball he won't give up or share (see Saboteur). Many of his heroes start out this same way. They are ignorant and rather selfish. Everything must come to them. During the course of a film, they grow up to be men or women, not children, and this requires decision making skills. Perhaps all Hitch's heroes and heroines must learn to decide for themselves, think on their own, not based on faulty arguments or information given by false friends or relatives. The second requirement of a Hitch hero is that he must ACT. Hero or heroine, all have physical and psychic boundaries place upon them, which they must break free of. They must break free from their own brains which send false signals. They must escape their inner world, leap back into the REAL WORLD. A physical world that requires action to keep it from spinning off in the wrong direction, into destruction.
Ultimately, the hero in Hitch's films is an apolitical being in a political world. He must come down on one side or the other, or be a villain as everyone thinks he is already. If those rumors about HIM being a villain are groundless, what else is overlooked or untrue in life? The hero must question and decide. Inaction would HELP destroy the very thing that makes his world a good and decent place. The hero must atone for the sin of inaction he committed unwittingly, through his own selfishness. He has to get over himself as the center of the universe. He is acted upon, wrought by change, like a piece of coal into a diamond. But his own action is the agent of his biggest change. His foolish stumbling and eventual questioning somehow rubs off the edges. He/She starts foolish or lazy or angry or shy, but in the end, takes charge of his own destiny, and becomes a member of the world. By the end of a Hitchcock film, he or she finally subscribes to Gandhi's philosophy, "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
Two of my favorites are on your list, Saboteur and Foreign Correspondent. I like how you tie them together with Hitch's other works, his hints at future or past movies.
I like that you talk about those "just plain Americans" in Hitch's work, Saboteur to be exact. This is what I love most about his films. The normal, simple folks who make a decision and act, not based on a party line or what someone else said, but because they care about human beings. Theresa Wright in Shadow of a Doubt. We could say the real hero of Strangers on a Train is that guy who goes under the merry go round to stop it from spinning wildly and killing children. Of course, it doesn't go as planned, but this is the perfect analogy for Hitch's world view, which is why it stands out as one of Hitch's most famous set pieces, which you also talk about. A description of Hitch's set pieces and what they mean would make a great thesis.
I like that you mention Otto Kruger and James Mason in the same post, as villains extraordinaire. And Martin Landau, for that matter, since I love movies with more than one villain. Otto is the more evil to me than either of the other men, Mason, one can almost feel for. Hitch brings that line in Rules of the Game to life - "The awful thing about life is, everyone has their reasons." We see that a villain is not just a villain but an individual person, someone like the neighbor down the street with children or grandchildren. Or he could be a fiance who can love but who can also kill because he's too much of a capitalist to let his business affairs get away from him. Or a father who hides his past, knowing it's wrong on some level, but stuck because his affluence comes from his playing "the game". Business certainly gets a bad rep from Hitch since it's usually the excuse a villain has for his actions in Hitch's world.
Hitch's villains' actions ripple across our own tight little world in ways we can't even pretend to perceive, much like business, or events in the real world. When they are presented to us on the nightly news we think it doesn't affect us, but when a crash happens right in our own community we become aware. Shockingly aware.
Hitch likes to bring us into the light with a shock, just as you say, Maven. Do you think he was imitating this way we are brought vividly to our world, through shocks? Somehow this reminds me of a line in another movie, maybe you can tell me what movie it's from:Hitchcock also gives many satisfying jolts of suspense throughout “Saboteur”:
I haven't quite got it right, but maybe you can remember which movie it's from. It reminds me of Hitch. He wants us to know we're alive, and he does it by shocking us the way a natural disaster or major life event does.Men go through life as a series of shocks, you are born and that's a shock, you get married and that's another shock...
Here's another quote that seems to me relevant to the discussion of Hitch:
We aren't even aware of the existence of evil at the beginning of a Hitch movie, but are clued in because we simply can't remain unaware anymore. His heroes (and heroines) have much to learn, are sometimes dim, or foolish, or even 'bad' in certain ways. Spendthrift, like Johnnie Aysgarth in Suspicion. Lazy, like Roger O. Thornhill. But their worst trait is always their blindness to what's happening around them in the 'real' world. Blind, like Connie Porter, Tallulah Bankhead's character in Lifeboat, who should see since it's her job, but doesn't. Blind, like Joel McCrea's Johnny Jones in Foreign Correspondent...funny, the two who immediately came to mind are both reporters, who are supposed to 'see' for a living, or bring things to the attention of others.Little men with little minds and little imaginations go through life in little ruts, smugly resisting all changes which would jar their little worlds.
Is this the main trait in Hitchcock's films? Alicia Huberman should be more aware of what is happening around her, after all, she's been on the sidelines of political events...but instead she leads a life of dissipation, runs away from any involvement because of the terrible acts of her father. She learns to ACT instead of blindly living day to day. Hitch forces these heroes and heroines to become aware of and to actually ACT to help others. Johnny Jones doesn't care a fig about world events. In fact, he wavers so much in retrospect that he could have propelled America into a sort of slavery to the powers of darkness (never mentioned as Nazis) through no fault of his own, except his simple ignorance. But he comes to know people who are affected by those events, he finds out what's important to him, and he must act upon it...and his girl must make a very similar decision. Lina in Suspicion must become aware that her husband Johnnie is in trouble, to think of him in order to save her marriage. She has to stop seeing how his actions affect HER and see how her actions affect HIM and those around her. Connie must become generous, give up her worldly goods to help others in the Lifeboat. Knowledge breeds heroic action, if you are willing to give up something for your fellow man.
The heroes of Hitch are remarkably like his villains, no wonder they are always being mistaken for them. A villain, according to Hitch, is one who can use the system for their own gain, like a child with a ball he won't give up or share (see Saboteur). Many of his heroes start out this same way. They are ignorant and rather selfish. Everything must come to them. During the course of a film, they grow up to be men or women, not children, and this requires decision making skills. Perhaps all Hitch's heroes and heroines must learn to decide for themselves, think on their own, not based on faulty arguments or information given by false friends or relatives. The second requirement of a Hitch hero is that he must ACT. Hero or heroine, all have physical and psychic boundaries place upon them, which they must break free of. They must break free from their own brains which send false signals. They must escape their inner world, leap back into the REAL WORLD. A physical world that requires action to keep it from spinning off in the wrong direction, into destruction.
Ultimately, the hero in Hitch's films is an apolitical being in a political world. He must come down on one side or the other, or be a villain as everyone thinks he is already. If those rumors about HIM being a villain are groundless, what else is overlooked or untrue in life? The hero must question and decide. Inaction would HELP destroy the very thing that makes his world a good and decent place. The hero must atone for the sin of inaction he committed unwittingly, through his own selfishness. He has to get over himself as the center of the universe. He is acted upon, wrought by change, like a piece of coal into a diamond. But his own action is the agent of his biggest change. His foolish stumbling and eventual questioning somehow rubs off the edges. He/She starts foolish or lazy or angry or shy, but in the end, takes charge of his own destiny, and becomes a member of the world. By the end of a Hitchcock film, he or she finally subscribes to Gandhi's philosophy, "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
[u][color=#4000BF]Jack[/color][/u] [u][color=#4000BF]Favell[/color][/u] wrote:I absolutely don't think the Midge scenes bring the movie down. On the contrary, they set up the plot, show that Scottie is a normal man to begin with, and show his disintegration as well. In other words, they show where he comes from and where he is going. If Midge didn't care, didn't see Scottie as a love interest, or if we didn't see the jocular relaxed relationship they have, this movie would not make sense. It would probably be unbearable, and we would not feel for Scottie one bit because we wouldn't know him. He could be Emile Meyer from Sweet Smell of Success and who would care about HIM if he were to go down into the heart of darkness?”
![Image](http://i618.photobucket.com/albums/tt270/CineMaven/f28ce734-9288-40c3-a5fd-7f3afe8da23f_zps54803286.jpg)
- JackFavell
- Posts: 11926
- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Thank you Vienna. Will do.[u][color=#4040BF]Vienna[/color][/u] wrote:Love your reviews, Cinemaven. More please
If that's anywhere near Kansas City, make sure you stop and take Shug out for a walkie.[color=#0040BF][u]RedRiver[/u][/color] wrote:I'm goin' to Soda City!
Soda City, here I come!
But he was a priest in “Paths of Glory.” But I guess you're right. No love for you, Emile.[u]Jack Favell[/u] wrote: "AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!" she screamed.![]()
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That really would be a nightmare.
![cry :cry:](./images/smilies/cry.gif)
Last edited by CineMaven on September 26th, 2013, 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- JackFavell
- Posts: 11926
- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Background music for my nightmare... ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
If you take Shug for a walk, make sure you take a look through the telescope in the shed while you're there.
Does anyone else just love the name Soda City for a ghost town? It conjures such an image.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
If you take Shug for a walk, make sure you take a look through the telescope in the shed while you're there.
Does anyone else just love the name Soda City for a ghost town? It conjures such an image.
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
[color=#800040][u]MissGoddess[/u][/color] wrote:I think you should be a TCM Morlock or have your own review blog/site, you write so vividly and you incorporate images perfectly. It's not easy to say a lot about a movie's plot, backstory or history while at the same time conveying a personal and defined opinion for the subject. You are unique.
![Shocked :shock:](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
I saw it back in its original release in 1964 as a kid. Girl, you don't want to envy THAT!!Yes, that's Roddy getting chewed out for being so mean as to catch an innocent fish. Nancy is the feisty Icthyologist. I envy you seeing Fate is the Hunter in theaters! I've asked Twilight Time if they will re-release it on DVD as I wasn't able to afford it when it came out a couple of years ago. They replied that it will be coming to Blu-ray in 2014. Great movie---a disaster film that is philosophical and thoughtful as opposed to action-oriented. To some that equals boring but it's my cuppa! Rod is so good he steals the show from Glenn Ford, the nominal star, and that's not easy to do.
![Laughing :lol:](./images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Hah! This man absolutely unnerved me:JackFavell wrote:Background music for my nightmare...
If you take Shug for a walk, make sure you take a look through the telescope in the shed while you're there.
Does anyone else just love the name Soda City for a ghost town? It conjures such an image.
![Image](http://i618.photobucket.com/albums/tt270/CineMaven/c5f2a274-c14b-4616-8a25-e7b63b526811_zps88b38d0d.jpg)
What an interesting little nugget Hitchcock threw in there with this odd little man. What the heck???
![Shocked :shock:](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
- JackFavell
- Posts: 11926
- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
I like his portrayal of this guy as a psychopath whose mental illness came on long ago when his mother cut his hair! Another villain who is a child.
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Relative to nothing plot-wise. Just a guy that's under the umbrella of Otto Kruger. I thought he was great. I liked when he got shaken out of his reverie as he talked of him letting his son's hair grow and he pretends that....
* * * * *
Darned good point, and great phrasing.
I hate to tell you that I don’t know where those movie quotes came from.
![Image](http://i618.photobucket.com/albums/tt270/CineMaven/f2b8f87f-e8db-4cf8-9b3a-d6c96bb63d86_zps45e1b5fb.jpg)
I like how you laid out the different character traits of his clueless heroes and heroines.
* * * * *
I was really struck by those folks Cummings ran into when I watched the film this last time out; I liked how warmly I felt about them and the patriotism of the film. Now believe me, I know it’s all a movie. But I can’t help but think that our American culture has changed. Something is lost. The powers-that-be have divided us now into red states and blue states and “you're-on-your-own-buddy” to divide and conquer us. Something just hit me when I watched “Saboteur.” Maybe it was always a fantasy, “us Americans” but still......Jack Favell wrote:I like that you talk about those "just plain Americans" in Hitch's work, Saboteur to be exact. This is what I love most about his films. The normal, simple folks who make a decision and act, not based on a party line or what someone else said, but because they care about human beings..."
Ooooh, it absolutely would. I’d need a Hitchcock set of DVDs for that project. It’s a great idea.A description of Hitch's set pieces and what they mean would make a great thesis.”
I agree with you there. I got just the broadest of strokes that Mason’s getting that microfilm was not AS dangerous as Kruger wanting to burn down our entire American system. Tell little Susie the boogey man is her grandpa! "Boo!"I like that you mention Otto Kruger and James Mason in the same post, as villains extraordinaire. And Martin Landau, for that matter, since I love movies with more than one villain. Otto is the more evil to me than either of the other men, Mason, one can almost feel for.”
Or a father who hides his past, knowing it's wrong on some level, but stuck because his affluence comes from his playing "the game".
Darned good point, and great phrasing.
I think Hitch is just a bad boy who likes to wait until we’re quietly complacent sitting there in the theatre eating our popcorn, looking up at the screen, and then he goes “BOO!!!!” Buttered popcorn all over your poodle skirt. Raisinettes all in the lady’s hair in front of us.Hitch likes to bring us into the light with a shock, just as you say, Maven. Do you think he was imitating this way we are brought vividly to our world, through shocks?"
I hate to tell you that I don’t know where those movie quotes came from.
I think you’ve hit on the kernel, the essence of Hitchcock. He’s trying to make US aware...clue US in through his characters. You know Cary Grant. You love Cary Grant? Well here...take him, says Hitch.We aren't even aware of the existence of evil at the beginning of a Hitch movie, but are clued in because we simply can't remain unaware anymore. His heroes (and heroines) have much to learn, are sometimes dim, or foolish, or even 'bad' in certain ways.”
![Image](http://i618.photobucket.com/albums/tt270/CineMaven/f2b8f87f-e8db-4cf8-9b3a-d6c96bb63d86_zps45e1b5fb.jpg)
I like how you laid out the different character traits of his clueless heroes and heroines.
Great Wendy! Again you’ve distilled and boiled down to a kernel, Hitchcock’s m.o. James Stewart takes action in “The Man Who Knew Too Much” and in “Rear Window” he sends his advocates out into the big bad darkness. Ingrid Bergman acts on behalf of patient/lover Gregory Peck. Teresa Wright acts to save her family in “Shadow Of a Doubt.” Cary Grant has to find the real agent in “North By Northwest.” Do you think thought about doing anything more than raising a martini to his lips? Now look at him...on Mount Rushmore for pete’s sake.The second requirement of a Hitch hero is that he must ACT. Hero or heroine, all have physical and psychic boundaries place upon them, which they must break free of. They must break free from their own brains which send false signals. They must escape their inner world, leap back into the REAL WORLD. A physical world that requires action to keep it from spinning off in the wrong direction, into destruction.”
So very very well-put. Whew! I’m glad I wrote ahead of you. I’d hate to follow you! We all here at the Oasis offer food for thought for each other as we write about these great and not-so-great films. And you, Chef Favell, have served up your share of tasty dishes!But his own action is the agent of his biggest change. His foolish stumbling and eventual questioning somehow rubs off the edges. He/She starts foolish or lazy or angry or shy, but in the end, takes charge of his own destiny, and becomes a member of the world. By the end of a Hitchcock film, he or she finally subscribes to Gandhi's philosophy, "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
- MissGoddess
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Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Suzanne is wonderful in FITH.
![Image](http://www.coffeecoffeeandmorecoffee.com/archives/fate%20is%20the%20hunter%201.jpg)
![Image](http://www.coffeecoffeeandmorecoffee.com/archives/fate%20is%20the%20hunter%201.jpg)
"There's only one thing that can kill the movies, and that's education."
-- Will Rogers
-- Will Rogers
- JackFavell
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- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Gosh, no, I just get interested in the nuggets of information and inspiration you drop along the way. I sometimes carry it too far, I think. I am one of those over-analyzing types that have to work at a thing, wrastle it for awhile, to understand.So very very well-put. Whew! I’m glad I wrote ahead of you. I’d hate to follow you! We all here at the Oasis offer food for thought for each other as we write about these great and not-so-great films. And you, Chef Favell, have served up your share of tasty dishes!
Wow, I am loving that picture of Rod and Suzanne! Gorgeous! Have you guys been watching the Time Machine interstitial with Rod? He seems so nice and sweet in it. I love that they interviewed him. I wonder if Alexa did the interview?
I just can't remember that one quote about life being a series of shocks. I think it's worded differently, instead of shocks, it's some other word, a series of jerks?
Don't say it. I know life is a series of jerks, but that's not how the person saying it meant it.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
At first I thought it was from The Women. Then I thought it must be from a Hitch film. I can't for the life of me remember what it is, but I do believe it's spoken by a woman, about how men live their lives in fits and starts so to speak.
The second quote is not from a movie, it's a quote from a motivational speaker! it just makes me think of where Hitchcock starts his films. Little men in little ruts who will do anything to keep everything the same, even though everything is telling them to change.
It's been a while since I've seen North by Northwest, but I remember Mason being a man who was reasonable, who weighed the rightness of things, and who actually had emotions. He doesn't want to get rid of Eva Marie Saint as I recall, because he has a relationship with her. I felt just the least bit sorry for him when he found he'd been betrayed by her, though of course, I didn't want to see her hurt. He has to make a decision to act, too. It kind of ups the ante, suspense wise. Hell hath no fury like a lover scorned.
Kruger just seems nuts to me! Like he has no scruples, no internal thermostat of right and wrong. He's just so lackadaisical. He would laugh if someone were to go after him, or be unmoved if someone died in front of him. I find him scarier than almost any other villain, just because he's so sure the balance of power is his. And he thinks he's wonderful! He has no guilt or feelings of empathy. Just a happy guy, who is willing to sell out everything, like you say, not only on the outside, but from within. As long as he comes out on top. He doesn't even seem to see the ultimate outcome of his actions. A man who acts but DOESN'T Think? Maybe he is the opposite of the Hitch hero. He could look at a group of mothers and babies and tell them he was on their side, and blow them to kingdom come the next minute. The ultimate politician.
As for Rear Window, even Jimmy in his full cast has to act eventually. He's put everyone else out there, tried to stop it, but fate comes to meet him anyway. It's a really good example of those reluctant heroes. I think maybe Hitch was saying that people with brains eventually have to stop relying on them and DO something. it's great to think about stuff all the time, but once in a life, you have to put aside everything and stand up for something.
Ha! That made me laugh! Especially when I thought of the time I went to the movies and spent a huge amount of money on a giant bucket of popcorn for me and my friends, then tripped on a step up into the aisle (it was an old fashioned movie palace) and spilled it ALL before the movie even started....it was like a cartoon! But some of it fell into the hood on the lady in front of me, and I never did tell her that her winter coat was full of popcorn.I think Hitch is just a bad boy who likes to wait until we’re quietly complacent sitting there in the theatre eating our popcorn, looking up at the screen, and then he goes “BOO!!!!” Buttered popcorn all over your poodle skirt. Raisinettes all in the lady’s hair in front of us.
- MissGoddess
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Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Wendy, I believe your quote is the last shot from The Grapes of Wrath, spoken by Jane Darwell when she's talking about a man's life.
"There's only one thing that can kill the movies, and that's education."
-- Will Rogers
-- Will Rogers
- JackFavell
- Posts: 11926
- Joined: April 20th, 2009, 9:56 am
Re: ALFRED HITCHCOCK
Oh man, THANK YOU. What a terrible free-floating anxiety that was causing me! I'm so relieved. Whew! I really should have known that one.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)