Westerns

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mrsl
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Post by mrsl »

Miss Goddess:

I know . . . , I was surprised to see that both Mitchum and Hayworth were in it. Its called The Wrath of God (1972), Mitchum plays a priest(!!), and Frank Langella is also in it. It's on at 10:00 a.m. and again later at 7:00 p.m. That's Chicago time so it may be different for you.

You are probably right that now its Autry, Cheyenne, and Maverick. I didn't realize Cheyenne was on for 7 years, so at least they will have plenty of episodes to show. Actually, I went through 2 full cycles of The Rifleman, and about half before they pulled it, so I was ready for a change. I had started halfway through, then from episode 1 to 58, two times, and shortly after that is when you came in.

Do you ever watch Cimarron Strip with Stuart Whitman on Saturday a.m.? That's another good one, more like a movie because the episodes are 90 minutes long. I have to admit that I have never seen any of the supporting cast on anything else since the show ended, but Whitman looks pretty good on that one - but nothing can beat Clint Walker, he's the absolute cherry on top of the sundae, much as I feel like a traitor, even Chuck takes a second to him.

Anne
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MissGoddess
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Post by MissGoddess »

Hi Anne! Yes, I've caught a couple of episodes of "Cimarron Strip" and enjoyed them. Stuart was a cutie.

Never heard of Wrath of God but I will try to catch it. I wonder if Mitch's priest is another psycho like his parsons in Night of the Hunter and 5 Card Stud?
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jdb1

Post by jdb1 »

mrsl wrote: Do you ever watch Cimarron Strip with Stuart Whitman on Saturday a.m.? That's another good one, more like a movie because the episodes are 90 minutes long. I have to admit that I have never seen any of the supporting cast on anything else since the show ended, but Whitman looks pretty good on that one - but nothing can beat Clint Walker, he's the absolute cherry on top of the sundae, much as I feel like a traitor, even Chuck takes a second to him.

Anne
Oh, Anne, how could you? Stuart Whitman's looks turn me off. Clint Walker is a real cutie, but no one can compare, in my book, to the rugged big guy with the slightly dangerous aura, Chuck Connors. Must be that Brooklyn drinking water again. It makes a boy into a man (and turned a Brooklyn Kevin into a Western Chuck).
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mrsl
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Post by mrsl »

Calm down Judith:

I said Whitman looked pretty good, but he's not my type - if you recall, I've said more than once I like a man whose life shows in his face - a man who deserves a couple of scars and lines. Don't get me wrong, I don't mean Wallace Beery, but Mitchum, Chuck, Clint (both Walker & Eastwood), and all the others. Mainly I guess that's why I always went for older men, their faces are comfortable, their laugh lines are etched, and their cheeks don't look like a baby's butt. Then some, like Mitch and Bogie just naturally start out looking like my kind of man.

Anne
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moira finnie
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Post by moira finnie »

ken123 wrote:Last night, actually early Thursday morning The Western Channel was showing an episode of Cheyenne ( episode #3 ) that was a remark, of sorts , of The Treasure of the Sierra Madre, in some places the dialogue was exactly word for word, with Edward Andrews uttering the Bogart lines. I watched only about 15 minutes of this episode :cry:
You neglected to mention that Warner Brothers cast Rod Taylor in the Tim Holt role in this tv version of The Treasure of the Sierra Madre with Clint Walker playing the Walter Huston part. This must have been the only time when Edward Andrews (a man who was born to play "Babbitt" as he did in Elmer Gantry), inherited a role played once by Humphrey Bogart. At least they credited B. Traven at the end of the show, though most of the creativity in this episode revolved around the "imaginative" casting choices made for this tv show.

Today I came home from work in time to catch a Cheyenne adaptation of the Errol Flynn Western, Rocky Mountain (1950). The girl in the tv show even wore the same costume that Patrice Wymore wore in the movie and, of course, WB used all the footage of the desert that they'd shot for the Flynn pic, though they gave it an upbeat ending instead of the tragic one in the film. The only other difference: none of the bleak poetry of the Flynn movie made it into the tv show.

I have yet to watch enough of the Cheyenne shows to make much of a judgment on them, other than Warner's certainly meant it when they purchased a script "in perpetuity" and it was amusing to see these plots recycled, especially since things were made more hunky dory by the end of both scripts (unlike the originals)--though there were casualties. I can't wait to see if a future episode adapts Angels With Dirty Faces or They Knew What They Wanted into an hour long episode with Clint Walker straightening out some frontier Eastside Kids or overturning the murder conviction of an unjustly accused Northerner. Btw, in portions of two other Cheyenne episodes I caught yesterday there were three instances in which the rights of Hispanics, Indians and even women were spoken of by principal actors who seemed to believe that they mattered. I was impressed with this streak of quiet tolerance. I wonder if it reflected that lingering Warner's espousal of liberal social causes in their films, perhaps left over from the '30s and an indication of the social upheavals that were rumbling beneath the surface of the discontented '50s.

Mr. Walker, all 6'6" of him, makes for pleasant company, though he doesn't seem to have much flexibility as an actor. If you are interested, here is an interview with him courtesy of Classic Images, and here is his own website, at clintwalker.com
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Post by movieman1957 »

I watched Cheyenne Autumn last night. Too long, too little going on. The Army is mostly comprised of numbskulls. THey make repeated errors in judgement causing them problems. Widmark is fine as a frustrated officer doing what he can to help the Cheyenne as they are increasingly put upon to live in an area where they can't possibly live. Having had enough they leave to go back to the Dakotas. Grief, weather and some infighting make the journey a trial. Edward G. Robinson makes a nice cameo.

I think more could have been made of the trouble within the Cheyenne tribe especially with Mineo's character as young hot head as the incidents at the end don't seem to be properly set up.

The whole Wyatt Earp bit in the middle (about 17 minutes worth) I still think was not needed and only served to interrupt the film.

Good cast. Lots of Ford regulars. There just needed to be more for as long as it was.
Chris

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Post by MissGoddess »

Anne, I missed all but about 10 minutes of Wrath of God. It didn't seem that great, very violent and I didn't see Rita at all. Maybe her part is small.

Chris---I have only watched CA once from start to finish. I haven't examined it too closely. I know I felt it was too long, too but I was very moved by many individual scenes. I didn't like Sal Mineo's character at all, so you are probably right about his character being underdeveloped. That's what makes for a stronger epic, if you can tell an intimate story within the context of a larger one, and I think Ford for whatever reasons wasn't able to get that done here. I understand making this film turned out to be a heartbreaking experience for him.
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mrsl
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Post by mrsl »

I've only seen Cheyenne Autumn two or three times actually because I get so angry when I watch it. You would think I was 100% Indian instead of Polish and Italian the way I get affected by how the American Indian was treated. I know they are actually descendants of European tribes that crossed over the oceans during the Ice Age, as well as some from the south American regions, but that was centuries before the White man came along, so I still feel the land belonged to the Indians. Anyway, two things make me see red, one is the way Indians were treated and lied to, and the second is how Japanese people were treated during WWII. Both things are shameful legacies to pass on.

Rita's part in Wrath of God is relatively small, but the whole movie is terribly bloody. Made in 1972 (which I didn't realize at first), I'm not surprised but I hate the thought that either Mitch or Rita contributed their talents to it.

Moira, I never understood what that whole Jimmy Stewart part was doing in the movie, actually, I thought someone had started a roll from another movie by mistake.

As I said in another post, there are some quite good movies coming on and I am enjoying the Cheyenne series a lot. Today alone, I've watched three movies on the Western Channel, then switched back to TCM for The Magic Box.

Anne
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Post by movieman1957 »

I sat through Heaven's Gate tonight. One thing is for sure is you can tell where the $40 million went. Cimino's attention to detail is to be admired if nothing else. A huge cast of extras with great attention to the costuming along with great sets and location shooting.

Too bad the movie is nearly an hour and forty five minutes in before the story really gets going. Once is does it moves along at a pretty good clip. It is also pretty intense. The film seems like it would have been better served by some editing. I know that can create problems in itself but it seemed like there were plenty of shots that did nothing to advance the story. I thought the whole Harvard scene at the beginning could have been left out. The only purpose it seems to have served was to show that some of the characters knew each other. It did look beautiful though. Characters would be introduced and then not heard from only to turn up again later. (Masur and Walken.)

Now the confusing part. Why does the film look so brown? Was he trying to give it a silent film look? What if they had movies in 1890? Was it just mood? Rarely, did the grass look green and the sky blue. I know it is what he intended but am curious why.

Not much music. At the end "The Blue Danube" is played by guitars over the end of the battle. No doubt the river must run through the homeland of the settlers but it it sounded out of place.

I think I saw a new credit in the end titles - "Atmosphere Casting." ??? It also gives credit to Leonard Bernstein and the New York Philharmonic for "The Blue Danube" when the recording doesn't appear to be in the movie.

I'm glad I saw it. Not sure how soon, if at all, I'd revisit it.
Chris

"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana."
klondike

Post by klondike »

movieman1957 wrote:I sat through Heaven's Gate tonight. One thing is for sure is you can tell where the $40 million went. Cimino's attention to detail is to be admired if nothing else. A huge cast of extras with great attention to the costuming along with great sets and location shooting.

Too bad the movie is nearly an hour and forty five minutes in before the story really gets going. Once is does it moves along at a pretty good clip. It is also pretty intense. The film seems like it would have been better served by some editing.
I read somewhere that, start to finish, Cimino shot over one million feet of film for Heaven's Gate, which evidently equals or surpasses the annual totals for some of the old time studios.
Over one million feet.
:shock:
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Post by movieman1957 »

I hadn't heard that. Short of retakes for errors I can't imagine what was left out.

One other thing to add is I thought the very end wasa very interesting. Kristofferson is on his yacht with, I assume, the girl from Harvard. You can tell he is having a hard time reliving those years. His girl, asleep, on a lounge wakes up long enough to ask for a cigarette. He gets up hands her one. However, when he offers her a light she can't be bothered enough to lean forward a little bit. He must lean forward for her. Lazy broad. You can see his anger well up as he makes his way back up to the deck.
Chris

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Post by movieman1957 »

I watched Forty Guns last night. Very interesting but unusual film.

First I was very impressed with the look of it. The camera work had me before the credits. Mr. Fuller likes odd shots and unusual camera angles. They almost always add to the picture by how unusual they are.

The story isn't all that different than a typical type western but it moves a long pretty well and comes in at about 80 minutes. Stanwyck stars with Barry Sullivan, Gene Barry and Dean Jagger. I thought Jagger had the most interesting part as he to be the most underhanded but weakest of the lot.

Kudos for a very good and what seems realistic look at a tornado. Also, the film is set in a very nicely built western town. The DVD print was really good too.

Worth a look.
Chris

"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana."
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Post by MissGoddess »

Chris, you should try to watch Anthony Mann's THE FURIES next, if you can. It makes a fun companion movie to FORTY GUNS, I think. The Furies is more twisted in tone, and less amusing, but it's (to me) rather like "opera" to Forty Gun's "theater". :D

FG is fun and entertaining---I like that it goes ALL out and doesn't undercut its own highly colored emotions. If you think western style is always close to the vest and minimalistic, this movie and The Furies provide wonderful contrasts.

Loved the tornado scene!
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Post by movieman1957 »

I saw "The Furies" several years ago and enjoyed it. If I recall correctly it was Huston's last film. It is on my Netflix list as it is time for a revisit.

In "FG" the two camera shots that struck me as most odd were early on the really tight close up of Sullivan's eyes as he walks up to stare down one of the bad guys. The other was Gene Barry looking down a gun barrell at the lady gunsmith.
Chris

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Re: Westerns

Post by movieman1957 »

Lawman with Burt Lancaster is an interesting character study that suffers a little from a whole lot of talking. Lee J. Cobb is a big time rancher whose crew shoots up a town and accidently kills a town citizen. Lancaster is the man who comes after them. Robert Ryan plays the sheriff in the town where Cobb lives and is owned by Cobb.

The question for Lancaster's character is "how far can you go just because you're right?" Cobb wants to make it all go away without any more killing. Ryan wants to avoid trouble and ia busy playing go-between for Lancaster and Cobb. Nobody wants to go back for trial and are intent on making it difficult for Lancaster. This makes Lancaster all the more determined. When a few try a couple of dirty things on Lancaster, Ryan starts to get his pride back in himself and his job.

Just when you think it is all going to work out things go wrong. Minds are changed and it is all downhill.

Good cast. Lancaster is properly stoic. Cobb alternately tough and soft depending on who he is dealing with. Ryan has the most interesting part as one who, long past his prime, has settled for being bought until he gets a chance to help out and then sort of finds himself again. He is a new man.

Not much action until the end. Oddly enough the trailer is almost all of the climax but you wouldn't know who is who.

From 1970 you wll see lots of familiar faces and that helps keep it interesting. Nice movie for a group of aging actors.
Chris

"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana."
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