"The Merry Widow" (1925)...

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

Did anyone see Erich von Stroheim's "The Merry Widow" last night?

For years, I had only seen snippets of this movie, once at a Paramount tribute to silent stars in 1961. Mae Murray was there that night and was very pleased to receive generous applause.
About 2 years ago, TCM showed it and I watched it and thought it was Ok but silly.
Last night, I watched it again and I think there was new footage added as it was longer and there were scenes I didn't remember - scenes that made the film more natural and plausible.

I thought Mae Murray did a fairly good performance, especially since she was never known as an actress. I was proud of her and only wished I could have given her a hug and told her she was great!!

John Gilbert was good as the handsome hero, adequate but dull. I can't say I care if I see him again in anything again.
Roy D'Arcy and Tully Marshal were fun at first but all that leering and slobbering fast becomes boring. If that's all it takes to be in the movies, I'd be a top star in Hollywood today!!!

I did spot extra Clark Gable in the ballroom scene. He looked very young, But then he was gone very fast.

If you saw the picture or would like to comment on it , please do.
I'd really like to hear what you thought of it and my darling Maisie!!

Larry

[knitwit45]

Hi Larry.
I wasn't sure if it was Mae Murray or Mae Marsh that was your friend. I kept hoping last night it was Ms. Murray, she was so cute in this. I had to stop about 1/3 of the way, but DVR'd it so I could see what happens. I loved her "ballet" for the crown prince and John. I agree about the leering and slobbering...it was disgusting in about 3 seconds flat. Anyway, I thought Mae was feisty and funny and sweet and I'm really looking forward to the rest of the movie.

Wasn't it her funeral your Grandmother Nell was preparing to attend when she (Grandmother) had a sudden heart attack? I wish I could have met both of them!

Nancy

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi Nancy,

Yes, it was Mae Murray's funeral that Nell was going to when she dropped dead as she was going out the door.
Mae died on March 23, 1965 and Nell on March 30th...

I'm glad you liked Mae. George Hamilton tells the story of when he took her to the Hollywood Roosevelt Hotel in 1963 or 64 for a photography shoot of several silent movie stars. Mae was all in pink with a big pink hat and when they were all assembled, she called out to the photographer, "Make us all pretty again!"...
Ramon Novarro said, "She's still directing 'The Merry Widow' again!!".... Everybody laughed and that's the picture that came out in the paper...

Larry

[moira finnie]

I saw von Stroheim's The Merry Widow (1925) for the first time over the weekend. I suppose it is an indication of the decadence of our time today, but most of the racy stuff, like the Crown Prince's silly leering, the orgies, the blindfolded mandolin players, the writhing figures at the officer's parties, and especially the foot fetish stuff, seemed comical, and kept reminding me of Fearless Leader, Natasha and Boris in Bullwinkle and Rocky more than anything to do with Kraft-Ebbing or anything dark, dangerous and decadent.


Maybe it is just me, but did you see much chemistry between John Gilbert and Mae Murray? I've read that Mae Murray had to enlist the support of Irving Thalberg to have the Merry Widow Waltz included in the film--to the chagrin of von Stroheim, but even though it was a highlight of the overstuffed movie, it seemed rather truncated to me.

[drednm]

I'm not sure Mae Murray ever had any chemistry with any actor other than herself.

[moira finnie]

I'm not sure Mae Murray ever had any chemistry with any actor other than herself.

Um. Could be, though I've only seen her in this movie and the early talkie Bachelor Apartment (1931) in which she is fleetingly funny in an odd way.

[drednm]

Yes it's an odd role in Bachelor Apartment.... she doesn't quite fit in with Lowell Sherman and Irene Dunne.

I've also seen her in A Mormon Maid in which she seemed to be channeling Mary Pickford and the apparently incomplete Peacock Alley, which I liked but Murray seemed terrified. I also have a lousy copy of Mademoiselle Midnight but have never watched it.

[charliechaplinfan]

I like the Merry Widow but more for John Gilbert than Mae Murray. The only thing I can remember thinking about Mae Murray is that she looked good for her age, 37 at the time. A good Von Stroheim movie but not his best.

[drednm]

I also feel the movie belongs to John Gilbert....

[Gagman 66]

There were no new scenes included. This the exact same version of THE MERRY WIDOW with the Dennis James Theater Organ score that TCM has been running since probably 1994. I first saw it in 1999. However, there is a longer Road Show version , out there someplace which I just learned about, and it survives. This is occasionally screened at live events.

To be honest, this movie is not really one of my favorites, I'd much rather they had run THE BIG PARADE. (It seems to get less air time than any other major MGM silent.) The picture clearly needs additional restoration. Or at least this print does. Full of unsightly glare and artifacts, with occasional decomposition. Actually, a new print of "WIDOW" was struck from elements found in an Austrian Archive just recently. Apparently, there is a longer Road Show version that exists too. I did not even know this until just a couple days ago, about the Road Show release. All news to me.

I have a complete Orchestral score by Robert Israel for this picture recorded in 2004. Borrowing heavily from the Operetta, with probably a few of the original William Axt-David Mendoza themes as well. Just got the recording in MP-3 file format a few months ago, and eventually, I will attempt to match it up with the TCM print of the film. Danish artist Maud Nielssen also composed a new score that debuted at the Pordenone festival last fall to great acclaim. Nielssen had previously scored the alternate Photoplay Productions version of THE PATSY. The one that does not air in this country. With respect to Mr. James, the film really needs and Orchestral score.

If the ending to THE MERRY WIDOW seems a bit abrupt, it is. Irving Thalberg pretty much ordered Von Stroheim to "rap things up or else." Undoubtedly if Erich had his way the movie could have easily drug on for another three or four more reels. Mae Murray was 36 years old when the movie was made. There is no doubt that Sally O'Hara was supposed to be a much younger character. Imagine Eleanor Boardman in the part. My first choice of course would be Renee Adoree, but she was French, and Sally was supposed to be a girl from the Bronx.


Here is a nice still of Mae Murray in another extravagant production from the previous year.



Mae Murray and Lloyd Hughes "VALENCIA" (1924)

[pvitari]

Hello, this is my first post to the Silver Screen Oasis board. I have no idea what took me so long to find you all, I've been a big classic film buff (including silents) for many years. :)

Ah... The Merry Widow. I LOVE this movie, no doubt partly because the first time I saw it was a 35mm print projected on the giant screen at Atlanta's enormous (5000 seats plus) Fox Theatre -- and I was ensconced in the best seat in the house (front row center balcony). The screening was jointly co-sponsored by TCM and the Peachtree International Film Festival and was THE highlight of the festival for me. Dennis James was at the Mighty Moeller organ and his performance was recorded that evening for future presentations of the film on TCM and -- well, there was hope at the time -- DVD. I'll never forget how beautiful John Gilbert and Mae Murray looked on that giant screen, and how the powerful MIghty Mo filled the auditorium with glorious sound.

Seeing it on TCM isn't quite the same thing (even on a big screen TV) though I still find The Merry Widow utterly charming and delightful, the Von Stroheim "touch" with leers, foot fetishes and general raciness included. Seems nothing much has changed in the decades since -- we're all peeking in our own individual way. :) And I love that organ score, because it's so recognizably the wonderful Mighty Mo with all its bells and whistles (literally) and hearing it while watching The Merry Widow on TCM takes me back to that magic night in 1998.

Here's TCM's press release about the screening:

http://alt.tcm.turner.com/PRESS_ROOM/97 ... _widow.htm

It's great to meet you all and I expect I"ll be popping up now and then, here and there at the Silver Screen Oasis. :) :) :)

[knitwit45]

Welcome! You'll like it here, lots of friendly and knowledgeable people to share views about classic film. The "off-topic" threads are usually a lot of fun, we can get testy, but families do bicker now and then, and we always kiss and make up!

Nancy the knitwit...

[charliechaplinfan]

It's great to hear from you Pvitari, I envy you that screening. I'm a big fan of silents too, it's great to see another silent fan onboard

[pvitari]

Hi Nancy and Charliechaplin fan -- I worship Charlie by the way. (As well as Keaton, Lloyd and the other Charley -- Chase that is.)

Y'all can call me Paula.

Off for more exploring... so many movies, so many threads!

Unfortunately there is not much in the way of silents here in Atlanta anymore. Our Silent Film Society, which regularly held 16mm screenings, became defunct several years ago due to a combination of factors. Fortunately some Buster is on the way... the newly-restored Strand Theatre in Marietta, GA will have a 35mm screening of The General (with live accompaniment) on March 14. This screening was originally supposed to take place a few weeks ago but was cancelled due to bad weather. They're also showing Singin' in the Rain on Feb. 12 and Casablanca on Feb. 14. For information, go to http://www.earlsmithstrand.org/

I know Buster and the two talkies are off-topic in this post, so my apologies and I will try not to get off-topic again. I didn't see a thread for screenings -- is there one?

[Vecchiolarry]

Hello Paula,

How thrilling for you to have that experience of seeing a movie as it was meant to be viewed....
Mae Murray would have been ecstatic to see her film presented as a premier event. Her quote: "Once a star, one is always a star" would have rang true that night...

Thanks for telling us...

Cheers,
Larry