In the TCM Great Directors' thread, i started wondering if the history of Chile vs. Argentina has been film fodder. Sort of like SEVEN DAYS IN MAY or ON THE BEACH or MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE have used the USA vs. Commie Pinko conflicts.
My question to Fernando would also include, "And if there were Argentina vs. Chile films, were they done by major directors and/or major stars?" I think SEVEN DAYS IN MAY is an incredible film for that reason, as much as the story itself. It's a major film from top to bottom.
ON THE BEACH, too.
MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE might be the 'weakest' cast of these three, in fact, with 'only' Frank Sinatra, Janet Leigh, Lawrence Harvey and Angela Lansbury headlining. It's supporting cast is certainly recognizable, but it's not like having Edmund O'Brien as a second-line character actor as he is in SEVEN DAYS. Or using Fred Astaire as a bit character in BEACH.
Still, the stars and the directors of these three films (and many others, like THE BEDFORD INCIDENT, etc.) gave a huge value to stories that exploited the East-West Cold War tales. I don't consider either film to be flattering to the Good Guys - the good ol' USA - either. It's kinda hard to be waving the vigorous flag like General Burt Lancaster wanted us to, or marching behind it the way Evil Angela would have tricked us into doing. (Much less standing outside 'on the beach' somewhere.)
Us vs Them films
Re: Us vs Them films
Ollie
Seven Day's In May and All The President's Men remind me of the British drama doc based on fact
The Plot Against Harold Wilson (2006) (TV)This compelling drama/documentary details the events leading up to, and surrounding the resignation of Harold Wilson as Prime Minister in 1976.
Rated 7.1/10 · Documentary Drama · 90 min
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0780586 · Cached page
Harold Wilson was I think a Prime Minister that history will look back well on. He refused to send British troops to Vietnam and as a result wasn't given much need finnacial help from the Johnson administration. However, he was at the time accussed of being a communist, which now turns out to be a smere by the right wing intelligence services and Lord Louis Mountbattten, who it seems were at least thinking about over throwing a democratic Labour Goverment out of office. The connection with ATPM is the fact Harold had two journalists fighting his corner.
It seems to me both the Wilson plot and Seven Days In May are very similar, only one is fiction and the other most probably fact
Seven Day's In May and All The President's Men remind me of the British drama doc based on fact
The Plot Against Harold Wilson (2006) (TV)This compelling drama/documentary details the events leading up to, and surrounding the resignation of Harold Wilson as Prime Minister in 1976.
Rated 7.1/10 · Documentary Drama · 90 min
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0780586 · Cached page
Harold Wilson was I think a Prime Minister that history will look back well on. He refused to send British troops to Vietnam and as a result wasn't given much need finnacial help from the Johnson administration. However, he was at the time accussed of being a communist, which now turns out to be a smere by the right wing intelligence services and Lord Louis Mountbattten, who it seems were at least thinking about over throwing a democratic Labour Goverment out of office. The connection with ATPM is the fact Harold had two journalists fighting his corner.
It seems to me both the Wilson plot and Seven Days In May are very similar, only one is fiction and the other most probably fact
Re: Us vs Them films
That is a good one, and I've been waiting for its DVD release (hope hope). I've always appreciated that Harold Wilson decided not to get paid off but that seems to be a decision he was happy with - get paid to help, or don't get paid and stop whining about lack of money.
I've also wondered if SEVEN DAYS was a pre-emptive strike against the American right-wing. It along with the JFK Assassination certainly didn't make the hawks look like doves. I've always assumed the President was a characterization of Eisenhower, who'd suffered slings and arrows of so-called field generals during WWII for Eisenhower's Pentagon Bureaucrat history. Not that "field generals" in those early days had a lot of great experience to lord over anyone. Then as El Presidenté, Ike used his Pentagon Bureaucrat history to try to castrate the Military Industrial Complex which was trying to rebound from numerous post-WWII cutbacks. Eisenhower kept warning folks in inaugural and State Of The Union speeches, but they merrily bounced back, just fine, thank you. Plenty of money in the arms industry - never fear!
A Wiki entry says the novel's author got the idea after talking to that lovely, kind and peaceful soul, Curtis LeMay. Wow. Now THAT would be amazing if true - LeMay would identify someone as MORE hawkish than himself?!! Wow...
I've also wondered if SEVEN DAYS was a pre-emptive strike against the American right-wing. It along with the JFK Assassination certainly didn't make the hawks look like doves. I've always assumed the President was a characterization of Eisenhower, who'd suffered slings and arrows of so-called field generals during WWII for Eisenhower's Pentagon Bureaucrat history. Not that "field generals" in those early days had a lot of great experience to lord over anyone. Then as El Presidenté, Ike used his Pentagon Bureaucrat history to try to castrate the Military Industrial Complex which was trying to rebound from numerous post-WWII cutbacks. Eisenhower kept warning folks in inaugural and State Of The Union speeches, but they merrily bounced back, just fine, thank you. Plenty of money in the arms industry - never fear!
A Wiki entry says the novel's author got the idea after talking to that lovely, kind and peaceful soul, Curtis LeMay. Wow. Now THAT would be amazing if true - LeMay would identify someone as MORE hawkish than himself?!! Wow...
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movieman1957
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Re: Us vs Them films
"Seven Days" is a long time favorite for me. I have an old tape but love to get a DVD. There is a discussion waiting for that film alone.
Chris
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana."
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana."
Re: Us vs Them films
Yes, great film. Hard to stomach, hard to sit thru for me, but tremendous, and a sell-out every time at local showings. I think they could put it up in a megaplex and sell it out, too.
That's why Stuart's offering THE PLOT AGAINST HAROLD WILSON is a great addition. It was not portrayed as powerfully as this fictional piece, and that begs another question ("WHY NOT?!!") nor was it given a huge release. (Another "WHY NOT?")
I hope we can collect a lot of films - particularly the non-Hollywoods - that would illustrate film versions of political intrigues, semi-cold-war episodes (Pakistan, Indian, Chile-Argentina, etc. We've had a few dealing with the African disasters of recent years, but they too draw little attention. These additional names may have to sit on my Wish List until they're released on DVDs, but I'd definitely enjoy collecting and watching them.
That's why Stuart's offering THE PLOT AGAINST HAROLD WILSON is a great addition. It was not portrayed as powerfully as this fictional piece, and that begs another question ("WHY NOT?!!") nor was it given a huge release. (Another "WHY NOT?")
I hope we can collect a lot of films - particularly the non-Hollywoods - that would illustrate film versions of political intrigues, semi-cold-war episodes (Pakistan, Indian, Chile-Argentina, etc. We've had a few dealing with the African disasters of recent years, but they too draw little attention. These additional names may have to sit on my Wish List until they're released on DVDs, but I'd definitely enjoy collecting and watching them.
Re: Us vs Them films
I'd never seen THE MAN BETWEEN (1953 d-Carol Reed; James Mason, Claire Bloom, Hildegard Knef in bombed-out Berlin) but was introduced to a lot of strong openings that were sometimes overwhelmed by contrived behaviors and scenes. I thought this was be a political East vs West thriller but instead it's a gangster-kidnapping not-so-thriller that starts with much promise but gets all of its loose ends neatly tied up at the very end. It could have been worse - it could have been a dream sequence.
It looks like Carol Reed was so enthralled with the Berlin ruins that he just HAD to photograph them, and getting his characters to wander thru them or hide in those were 'easy' for him but those felt too contrived too frequently. Claire Bloom flipflops from incredibly naive little sister into a keen observer, then back to the ingenue that stands still for any auto nearby, then into a shrewd kidnap victim, then back to ingenue with a bat of her eyes. I kept thinking, "She's from London but still seems mesmerized by the sight of a car approaching? She can't move her legs at all? Deer in headlights have a better ideas of what to do."
Hildegard Knef is tantalizing and does so well in so many places, then she disappears and is hardly shown on-screen. I wondered, is she too a mere contrivance for Director Reed?
All of these criticisms still don't make me like the film less. This film feels like a film-school exercise for me - "Study this film and come up with 5 changes..." One of them would NOT be the cinematographer.
And instead of casting this as an Us vs. Them - East vs. West Thriller - and many references are made to that in the film - I ended up with a well-photographed kidnapping film with actors delivering strong performances.
It looks like Carol Reed was so enthralled with the Berlin ruins that he just HAD to photograph them, and getting his characters to wander thru them or hide in those were 'easy' for him but those felt too contrived too frequently. Claire Bloom flipflops from incredibly naive little sister into a keen observer, then back to the ingenue that stands still for any auto nearby, then into a shrewd kidnap victim, then back to ingenue with a bat of her eyes. I kept thinking, "She's from London but still seems mesmerized by the sight of a car approaching? She can't move her legs at all? Deer in headlights have a better ideas of what to do."
Hildegard Knef is tantalizing and does so well in so many places, then she disappears and is hardly shown on-screen. I wondered, is she too a mere contrivance for Director Reed?
All of these criticisms still don't make me like the film less. This film feels like a film-school exercise for me - "Study this film and come up with 5 changes..." One of them would NOT be the cinematographer.
And instead of casting this as an Us vs. Them - East vs. West Thriller - and many references are made to that in the film - I ended up with a well-photographed kidnapping film with actors delivering strong performances.