By the way, MissG, I'm not surprised there were few young people at the Met (you did mean the Metropolitan Opera, not the Metropolitan Museum of Art, yes?) At $300+ a ticket for orchestra seats at the most popular performances, who else can afford it but the older and more established?
There are commercials on the radio for the Met where they make a big deal out of "reduced prices." Those prices aren't my idea of reduced. If opera wants to reach the general public, it's going to have stop charging aristocrat prices. I got my daughter two tickets to La Traviata at the Met in March as a holiday present -- they cost $250! And that's for the equivalent of the third balcony!
Really -- $320 for one ticket, at one performance? If I were going to spend that much money for one ticket, I'd just as soon go to a Yankee game. (But that's another overpriced story.)
The New Male Star
-
MissGoddess
- Posts: 5072
- Joined: April 17th, 2007, 10:01 am
- Contact:
Good morning all:
This is something else I've been shouted down about recently. I talked about the loss of music and art in grammar schools, and although some schools are lucky enough to have someone in the area who donated enough to offer a smaller version of such education, many schools no longer have any type of art or music teachers on payroll. Personally although I have a smattering of knowledge about the finer things, I never attempted to learn more. I was complacent for myself, but did try to push my kids. (Unfortunately, out of the four, I had no artists of either kind.) I took them to the Chicago Art museum but they had more fun playing hide and seek around all the nooks and crannies than looking at art, and I didn't dare take my boys 13 and 9 into the Renaissance room. In their case, Art and Music had already been taken out of the curriculum and I started too late for their education. I did fairly well with my oldest granddaughter and I'm working on the little ones now, but as will everything, when the parents don't cooperate, it's pretty hard to make points.
So if kids are not taught some sort of appreciation in school, unless they happen to have parents that love classical or operatic music, or know Renoir from Wood, or Picasso which the majority of us do not, just as a child cannot add a triple column of numbers without a calculator, they are lost. Also, if prices are that outrageous, I can see the arts fading from memory within 2 or 3 generations.
Before you sneer at my words, think about how many women you know who can knit, crochet, or embroider, or make a dress. Also, how many men do you know who can take a few pieces of wood and make a chair or table without using power equipment? Better yet, how many of your kids friends will sit down and read a book, or write a letter? The world moves so fast, nobody wants to take the time to do those things, and few people know the feeling of accomplishment you get when you use your brain instead of a bunch of little diodes and batteries.
I apologize for getting so off topic but some of the things said here made me think of this stuff. Today's young actors have no reason to learn their craft, they are offered exorbitant paychecks for looking pretty, so why should they learn? I think it was Dan Dailey or Donald O'Connor who said, 'way back, "These days you have to be a three way threat in order to succeed, you have to sing, dance and act". I'm paraphrasing but that was the gist of it, and I don't think young actors are given that kind of push today.
Anne
This is something else I've been shouted down about recently. I talked about the loss of music and art in grammar schools, and although some schools are lucky enough to have someone in the area who donated enough to offer a smaller version of such education, many schools no longer have any type of art or music teachers on payroll. Personally although I have a smattering of knowledge about the finer things, I never attempted to learn more. I was complacent for myself, but did try to push my kids. (Unfortunately, out of the four, I had no artists of either kind.) I took them to the Chicago Art museum but they had more fun playing hide and seek around all the nooks and crannies than looking at art, and I didn't dare take my boys 13 and 9 into the Renaissance room. In their case, Art and Music had already been taken out of the curriculum and I started too late for their education. I did fairly well with my oldest granddaughter and I'm working on the little ones now, but as will everything, when the parents don't cooperate, it's pretty hard to make points.
So if kids are not taught some sort of appreciation in school, unless they happen to have parents that love classical or operatic music, or know Renoir from Wood, or Picasso which the majority of us do not, just as a child cannot add a triple column of numbers without a calculator, they are lost. Also, if prices are that outrageous, I can see the arts fading from memory within 2 or 3 generations.
Before you sneer at my words, think about how many women you know who can knit, crochet, or embroider, or make a dress. Also, how many men do you know who can take a few pieces of wood and make a chair or table without using power equipment? Better yet, how many of your kids friends will sit down and read a book, or write a letter? The world moves so fast, nobody wants to take the time to do those things, and few people know the feeling of accomplishment you get when you use your brain instead of a bunch of little diodes and batteries.
I apologize for getting so off topic but some of the things said here made me think of this stuff. Today's young actors have no reason to learn their craft, they are offered exorbitant paychecks for looking pretty, so why should they learn? I think it was Dan Dailey or Donald O'Connor who said, 'way back, "These days you have to be a three way threat in order to succeed, you have to sing, dance and act". I'm paraphrasing but that was the gist of it, and I don't think young actors are given that kind of push today.
Anne
Anne
***********************************************************************
* * * * * * * * What is past is prologue. * * * * * * * *
]***********************************************************************
***********************************************************************
* * * * * * * * What is past is prologue. * * * * * * * *
]***********************************************************************
-
jdb1
You are so right, Anne, and I suppose eventually they won't have to do anything at all - it will all be motion-captured and computer generated.
Like on Futurama - presenting: the head of Brad Pitt!
The really sad part is that educators seem to have lost sight of the fact that music and art make for better students: they learn to sit still, they learn to concentrate, they learn to organize their thoughts, they learn to use their imaginations, etc. If anyone were to ask me what is the single most significant thing lacking in education today, I'd say that it was the fact that use of the imagination is not allowed - not for the children, and not for their teachers. I observe that young people, and there are many of them in my office, really don't seem to have much inner life. I guess that's why they always have cellphones glued to their ears - they need to keep talking because they haven't mastered the art of thinking. Without some degree of inner reflection, there can be no art. It's downright criminal.
MissG, as a New Yorker you understand perfectly what I was talking about - the Met, the Yankees, etc. Theater, opera, ballet and even sports are becoming exclusionary country clubs that only the very well off can afford to pursue. Just think --- once 35 years ago or so, I bought theater tickets for my boyfriend's birthday, and I splurged on orchestra seats -- the tickets were $16.50 each!!! Wow, what extravagance!! That was a couple of months' worth of saving up for me!!! And it was the first time I ever sat in the orchestra. As a child I was always with my frugal parents, up in the back of the balcony, usually when the show was just about to close, so they could get the $3.00 seats even cheaper. I spent the first part of my theater-going life seeing failing shows on those "twofer" tickets.
Like on Futurama - presenting: the head of Brad Pitt!
The really sad part is that educators seem to have lost sight of the fact that music and art make for better students: they learn to sit still, they learn to concentrate, they learn to organize their thoughts, they learn to use their imaginations, etc. If anyone were to ask me what is the single most significant thing lacking in education today, I'd say that it was the fact that use of the imagination is not allowed - not for the children, and not for their teachers. I observe that young people, and there are many of them in my office, really don't seem to have much inner life. I guess that's why they always have cellphones glued to their ears - they need to keep talking because they haven't mastered the art of thinking. Without some degree of inner reflection, there can be no art. It's downright criminal.
MissG, as a New Yorker you understand perfectly what I was talking about - the Met, the Yankees, etc. Theater, opera, ballet and even sports are becoming exclusionary country clubs that only the very well off can afford to pursue. Just think --- once 35 years ago or so, I bought theater tickets for my boyfriend's birthday, and I splurged on orchestra seats -- the tickets were $16.50 each!!! Wow, what extravagance!! That was a couple of months' worth of saving up for me!!! And it was the first time I ever sat in the orchestra. As a child I was always with my frugal parents, up in the back of the balcony, usually when the show was just about to close, so they could get the $3.00 seats even cheaper. I spent the first part of my theater-going life seeing failing shows on those "twofer" tickets.
Miss Goddess - I am an opera buff too, and used to attend regularly back in the 1980's. I didn't follow it much in the 1990's, as I was pursuing other interests, but am now interested in following the scene once again. My biggest surprise is the cost of the tickets, but you are talking about the Met which is the top opera venue in the US and even the world. What are the prices at NY City Opera? What are Brodway tickets going for? I don't follow sports at all, but what does it cost to attend the world series? I live 50 miles south of San Francisco, and would chose to go to the opera and ballet there, but here in San Jose the local opera company tickets are in the $40-70 range and is a great place for newcomers to the arts. At the Met you are seeing the top ranked singers in the world, the biggest and most opulant sets and costumes, as well as the orchestra - I would expect to pay top dollar for this. I am very happy about the telecasts and live transmission of shows to local movie theaters across the nation that the Met started last year, also they are starting to release more DVD's now, so I believe they are starting to reach out more for a new audience. The SF Opera even had a free simulcast to the Oakland sports arena of Samson & Dalila at the begining of this season.
Oh, another added comment. Talk about inflated prices - how much is a hotel room in Manhattan? $250-375?
Oh, another added comment. Talk about inflated prices - how much is a hotel room in Manhattan? $250-375?
-
MissGoddess
- Posts: 5072
- Joined: April 17th, 2007, 10:01 am
- Contact:
Broadway show tickets are often around $150 to $400 depending on where you sit. If you want to freeze and stand in line in Times Square, you might get a better deal.
The Metropolitan Opera house may be the best venue for Opera in the world (I disagree, it's plain and dowdy compared to Italian opera houses) but it is also the best funded. The patrons of this facility, as well of the Metropolitan Museum (many of whom are the same folk) are more than generous and there is no need whatever for the absurd pricing. There is a mistaken impression that they are needy for money. (I hope I don't get on anyone's hit list for this---they HATE when I say this to their faces---because I do know many people who are their biggest donors) The fact that they want to keep it secret that you don't have to pay the "suggested contribution" at the museums is evidence enough of the greed that goes on. It's a cultural point of view; everything in this town is about making profits, not about extending culture to all. I did not grow up with that mentality so I find it baffling. Especially with all the self-righteousness that goes with it; namely, "this is the most culturally rich city in the world!" Yes, for those that can afford it.
The Metropolitan Opera house may be the best venue for Opera in the world (I disagree, it's plain and dowdy compared to Italian opera houses) but it is also the best funded. The patrons of this facility, as well of the Metropolitan Museum (many of whom are the same folk) are more than generous and there is no need whatever for the absurd pricing. There is a mistaken impression that they are needy for money. (I hope I don't get on anyone's hit list for this---they HATE when I say this to their faces---because I do know many people who are their biggest donors) The fact that they want to keep it secret that you don't have to pay the "suggested contribution" at the museums is evidence enough of the greed that goes on. It's a cultural point of view; everything in this town is about making profits, not about extending culture to all. I did not grow up with that mentality so I find it baffling. Especially with all the self-righteousness that goes with it; namely, "this is the most culturally rich city in the world!" Yes, for those that can afford it.
-
jdb1
Jez, I'm not a kid any more, so I like to sit in "good" seats wherever I go. I usually pay between $87-102 per ticket for orchestra or front of the mezzanine (which is really the first balcony) for Broadway shows. Most Off-Broadway shows are a bit less, but if the show gets any kind of good word of mouth, the prices go up.
NYC Opera tickets can be had for as little as about $15, but those seats are pretty bad. Seats at lower altitudes range from about $60-130.
The last time, earlier this year, that I tried to get baseball tickets (NY Yankees), I was looking for something not too close, not too far away, and preferably on the 1st or 3rd base side. The cheapest ones offered online were $79 each, and once you clicked through to actually try to get them, they would tell you they were sold out. All you are ever offered online are bleacher seats, which I refuse to take. If you want to pay $250 or more, maybe you can get something online, but don't count on it. They always claim to be sold out. Then, if you are lucky enough to score Yankee tickets somewhere and get to the stadium, what you will see are rows and rows of empty seats (which you casually ease yourself into when no one's looking). Most Yankee seats are bought up by businesses to dole out to clients, or by tickets services hoping to sell to the desperate for $400 a pop. When no one shows for those seats, they are up for grabs by those in attendance. It's disgraceful. And with the new exorbitant player contracts the Yankees are committing to, we poor folk don't have prayer of ever seeing live baseball again (because it's just as bad at Shea Stadium with the Mets, and even with our local minor league team, the Brooklyn Cyclones). Woe is us.
I've often wondered about the Met's pricing, MissG, and you've answered the question. It seems to me that the richest of the rich New Yorkers love to get their names in the programs as sponsors, and a great many of them are listed in the highest dollar category. So where does all that money go? For "gala evenings" to entertain themselves?
NYC Opera tickets can be had for as little as about $15, but those seats are pretty bad. Seats at lower altitudes range from about $60-130.
The last time, earlier this year, that I tried to get baseball tickets (NY Yankees), I was looking for something not too close, not too far away, and preferably on the 1st or 3rd base side. The cheapest ones offered online were $79 each, and once you clicked through to actually try to get them, they would tell you they were sold out. All you are ever offered online are bleacher seats, which I refuse to take. If you want to pay $250 or more, maybe you can get something online, but don't count on it. They always claim to be sold out. Then, if you are lucky enough to score Yankee tickets somewhere and get to the stadium, what you will see are rows and rows of empty seats (which you casually ease yourself into when no one's looking). Most Yankee seats are bought up by businesses to dole out to clients, or by tickets services hoping to sell to the desperate for $400 a pop. When no one shows for those seats, they are up for grabs by those in attendance. It's disgraceful. And with the new exorbitant player contracts the Yankees are committing to, we poor folk don't have prayer of ever seeing live baseball again (because it's just as bad at Shea Stadium with the Mets, and even with our local minor league team, the Brooklyn Cyclones). Woe is us.
I've often wondered about the Met's pricing, MissG, and you've answered the question. It seems to me that the richest of the rich New Yorkers love to get their names in the programs as sponsors, and a great many of them are listed in the highest dollar category. So where does all that money go? For "gala evenings" to entertain themselves?
-
MissGoddess
- Posts: 5072
- Joined: April 17th, 2007, 10:01 am
- Contact:
-
jdb1
And besides the out of reach pricings, let's not forget the surfeit of tourists we now get, crowding us natives out of everything we love, and keeping the prices extra-high. I suppose it's good for the City, although I personally am certainly not getting much out of it. I predict that NYC will soon become like Paris in August - almost completely devoid of natives, trying to escape the crush of tourists.
I read an entry in that things that happen in NYC section of the NY Times that they run on Mondays. Some woman said that she was buying a coffee or something from a cart in the theater district, and balked at the price, saying "But I'm a New Yorker," at which the vendor gave her a discount. I actually did the same thing last summer near Times Square when a pretzel vendor wanted $3 for one soft pretzel! I said "How much is it for natives?" and he laughed and gave it to me for a dollar. Now if only the Met would afford us the same consideration.
I read an entry in that things that happen in NYC section of the NY Times that they run on Mondays. Some woman said that she was buying a coffee or something from a cart in the theater district, and balked at the price, saying "But I'm a New Yorker," at which the vendor gave her a discount. I actually did the same thing last summer near Times Square when a pretzel vendor wanted $3 for one soft pretzel! I said "How much is it for natives?" and he laughed and gave it to me for a dollar. Now if only the Met would afford us the same consideration.
-
MissGoddess
- Posts: 5072
- Joined: April 17th, 2007, 10:01 am
- Contact:
-
jdb1
This very morning, as I was crossing Third Avenue, a family of obviously English tourists was standing in front of me at the curb. A yellow school bus drove by and they got all excited. "Look! Look!, they said. "A yellow one, just like on the telly!"
I'm so glad they are enjoying the best NYC has to offer.
I'm so glad they are enjoying the best NYC has to offer.
Exchange rates right now are scary. I've been reading stories where people in England are flying to the States to do their Christmas shopping, because they get so many dollars now for their pounds that it's cheaper than shopping at home.
I'll make out like a bandit this year when my mother puts Christmas money in pounds into my English bank account, because it'll be worth so much more when I take it out in dollars. I also get the benefit that most things are cheaper in the States anyway, generally due to scale and tax (except bread: why bread?), and that they're even cheaper in my part of the country.
Five years ago, the $300 ticket you mention would have cost me £200. Now it would be less than £150. Given that I earned twice as much in England as I do in Arizona, you could effectively knock that in half again. If I moved back to England tomorrow, $300 would seem less than half as much and cheaper all the time.
I'll make out like a bandit this year when my mother puts Christmas money in pounds into my English bank account, because it'll be worth so much more when I take it out in dollars. I also get the benefit that most things are cheaper in the States anyway, generally due to scale and tax (except bread: why bread?), and that they're even cheaper in my part of the country.
Five years ago, the $300 ticket you mention would have cost me £200. Now it would be less than £150. Given that I earned twice as much in England as I do in Arizona, you could effectively knock that in half again. If I moved back to England tomorrow, $300 would seem less than half as much and cheaper all the time.
-
movieman1957
- Administrator
- Posts: 5522
- Joined: April 15th, 2007, 3:50 pm
- Location: MD
-
jdb1
Dawtrina, you would not be at all surprised, then, to see the hoardes of European tourists here in New York laden with more shopping bags than you can imagine. When I'm walking to the subway from work every evening, I see people trudging back to their hotels with armloads of shopping, and then I seem them the next evening, and the next in the same situation.
What they are carrying is always varied -- clothing, toys, sports equipment, cameras, etc. Our department stores must be cleaning up this season; however, it's not good for the rest of us, as prices are creeping higher and higher. Those of us on the American Plan aren't finding much in the way of bargains in NYC, I'm afraid.
What they are carrying is always varied -- clothing, toys, sports equipment, cameras, etc. Our department stores must be cleaning up this season; however, it's not good for the rest of us, as prices are creeping higher and higher. Those of us on the American Plan aren't finding much in the way of bargains in NYC, I'm afraid.
-
MissGoddess
- Posts: 5072
- Joined: April 17th, 2007, 10:01 am
- Contact:
The worst of it is that I live in New York and my family, including my mother, live in Europe. My mother receives Social Security in American dollars and to put delicately, it S-U-C-K-S. I can do little to help her. And my trips to Europe are almost ruined by the apalling expense of everything. I'd give anything to see the Euro plummet and so would most of my European friends.